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Poll: Nokia to release the Maemo Source Code.
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Nokia to release the Maemo Source Code.

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wmarone is offline wmarone
2011-05-26 , 19:34
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#151
Originally Posted by godofwar424 View Post
The ONLY OS that will ever be usable on a day-day basis allowing us to fully utilise our N900 is Maemo 5. MeeGo will NEVER get to where Maemo is now on the N900. On new phones made for MeeGo it could potentially be amazing.
What makes you say this? Seriously, you and abill_uk seem to be making similar points, both in the tone and in the lack of information backing them up.

Can you do what he refuses to, and explain what you mean?
 
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cfh11 is offline cfh11
2011-05-26 , 19:50
Posts: 1,062 | Thanked: 961 times | Joined on May 2010 @ Boston, MA
#152
Originally Posted by godofwar424 View Post
The ONLY OS that will ever be usable on a day-day basis allowing us to fully utilise our N900 is Maemo 5. MeeGo will NEVER get to where Maemo is now on the N900.
its a steep hill to climb, but i truly believe Meego will get there. and sooner than most think
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freemangordon is offline freemangordon
2011-05-26 , 19:58
Posts: 3,074 | Thanked: 12,961 times | Joined on Mar 2010 @ Sofia,Bulgaria
#153
Originally Posted by wmarone View Post
What makes you say this? Seriously, you and abill_uk seem to be making similar points, both in the tone and in the lack of information backing them up.

Can you do what he refuses to, and explain what you mean?
And because it seems You have some information which others are missing, will you please share it with us, i.e. what makes you think that n900 will have Meego distro comparable (if not better) than Maemo 5.

I don't get it guys, the thread was about Maemo 5, why out of the sudden it became some kind of flamewar? Again, it is about the choise, not about which OS is better. And for those who choose to stay with Maemo 5 it will be much easier to fix and improve things if source code is available. What has Meego to do with it? And all this nonsense that those who continue to develop for Maemo 5 is wasting his time. WTF? It is my time, let me waste it in the way I like, please. Thanks.
 

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wmarone is offline wmarone
2011-05-26 , 20:05
Posts: 1,746 | Thanked: 2,100 times | Joined on Sep 2009
#154
Originally Posted by freemangordon View Post
And because it seems You have some information which others are missing, will you please share it with us, i.e. what makes you think that n900 will have Meego distro comparable (if not better) than Maemo 5.
Why does everyone insist on wrapping this in circles? I, long ago, asked abill_uk to explain one of his points, and I would like godofwar24 to explain why he thinks MeeGo cannot ever be a replacement for Maemo 5 on the N900.

Please, I am asking those making assertions to support their point.

I don't get it guys, the thread was about Maemo 5, why out of the sudden it became some kind of flamewar?
This is not a flamewar. There are a number of points that have been brought up about this topic:
  • abill_uk insists that there are missing drivers, but refuses to explain this point
  • this sort of request has been made for years, repeatedly, to little success

abill_uk's response has been a concerted effort to not answer my question, and to accuse others of attacking him and promising to report people who question his assertions.
 
aperles is offline aperles
2011-05-26 , 21:26
Posts: 20 | Thanked: 18 times | Joined on Sep 2009 @ Valencia (Spain)
#155
My two cents.

I like the N900 and Maemo, but I don't see future for this niche.

I day will arrive when my belloved N900 will die, and I will need a substitute.

So the question is: Maemo will continue after the N900s era?

I think the response is no, so I need to consider other ways. Meego? Ubuntu?

As I exposed before, the CSSU work is fundamental at this phase, but we need to focus the effort in the future enhancing the present (Maemo).

This situation could be similar to others like Qtopia, openmoko, familiar ...

Regards,
Àngel
 
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woody14619 is offline woody14619
2011-05-26 , 21:31
Posts: 1,455 | Thanked: 3,309 times | Joined on Dec 2009 @ Rochester, NY
#156
Originally Posted by wmarone View Post
I would like godofwar24 to explain why he thinks MeeGo cannot ever be a replacement for Maemo 5 on the N900.
I won't answer... I'll let the Nokia-hosted MeeGo conference about N900 DE explain it for me:



Please read line one aloud: "This is and will not be for regular end users." Period. You can read the whole text and see more slides by clicking here.

Even the presenter, near the end of the demo video, notes that the camera still has issues, and overall "it needs work... But is surprisingly overall good." Not exactly a ringing endorsement.

Don't get me wrong. I would love to see MeeGo on the N900. I'm glad it's being worked on and developed. But it's simply not in a state to replace Maemo and still be a functional, stable, every-day full-use device. Maemo has that right now, and even it took time to get there. Do you really expect people to punch the reset button and go back to PR0.8 stability for an OS that's not supported and may or may not every be fully solid and released?

If anything, I see source from Meego DE being pulled by the community udpate teams to be adapted and replace Maemo closed-source code, not the other way around. Again, I'm not discouraging code from flowing in either direction. This is just what I predict. And I could be wrong (wouldn't be the first time)!

In the end though, it would be much easier to make a renewed appeal to Nokia to open parts of Maemo. That's been going on, but has stalled as Nokia shifted its attention to WP7. A large community campaign may get their attention, and rattle the cage enough to get their attention. Worst case, they'll do what they've been doing: Continue to ignore the end user and consider the old product line mothballed.

I see no harm in trying again. I don't expect a different result than before, but I don't see any harm in trying. If you think it's a wasted effort, so be it: Don't participate in it. Want to see real wasted effort? There are people still hacking OpenMoko on the FreeRunner. Go check out that effort and tell me asking Nokia for source is more futile.

I say go for it. Ask again. Make a petition... Picket an office if it will help. The worst case scenario is we get nothing more than we have now. I don't see a reason to discourage it if someone has the energy to try again. Smash into that wall again... who knows, it may crumble this time? Or not...
 

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godofwar424 is offline godofwar424
2011-05-26 , 21:52
Posts: 1,320 | Thanked: 915 times | Joined on Feb 2010
#157
Originally Posted by wmarone View Post
What makes you say this? Seriously, you and abill_uk seem to be making similar points, both in the tone and in the lack of information backing them up.

Can you do what he refuses to, and explain what you mean?
The NITDroid had ALOT of momentum behind it, and gave us a very good implementation of Android for the N900.

Yet it is still not even near able to replace maemo and even if it had full phone capabilities it will never be more usable then maemo is now.

MeeGo is getting there, but all the work in the world and its not going to get to the sort of level that maemo is at the moment.

Maemo 5 was made for the N900 and the N900 only! MeeGo was just adapted for the N900, the minimum specs requirements of MeeGo are higher then the internals of the N900.

Originally Posted by mikecomputing View Post
1. Phone:

Not sure here but cant the phone functionality be accessed via libofono or via dbus like in Meego? I dont see any reason the backend must be opened? What will that help you? You have too have the technical specificaions for the modem to if you want to implement what stuff it is missing or is buggy.
When I say release code for the 'Phone'.
I simply mean that they should release the source for the Phone application, not the actual modem. The bugs are within the Phone application NOT the modem driver.

Also the closed sections being open would also help with possibly updating the Kernel, GFX drivers ect.. resulting is fixing some little issues we have atm such as screen tearing.

Originally Posted by mikecomputing View Post
2. Conversation ("app" made by thirdparty if I remember correct so maybe not Nokias decision):

Again better make a new app based on Qt(Quick) and also port to Meego with full portrait/landscape support instead of continue "stupid gtk hacks".
You just suggested making a open source replacement using Qt?? Seriously??

We can't easily make open source replacement without the ORIGINAL source of the app. It would mean writing the application from scratch which could take MONTHS! With the original code, we could extract the relevant code and then is would take a number of weeks/days to make our open source replacement.

The main reason for releasing the code is so that we can easily make open source replacements without loosing functionality or spending extreme amounts of time on it.

Originally Posted by mikecomputing View Post
3. Calendar

I guess syncing is bigest issue here? But there was a guy working on the Meego conference working on a "syncapp" for Meego would be better backport his app for Maemo instead of use some deprecated sourcecode?
Actually its both syncing AND the fact that there is no such option for usable portrait in it. Also it has very awkward time settings for alarms and im sure there are loads of other features people might want in the calendar app.
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Well Nokia do at least know how to build a decent phone, just apparently don't know how to support it..

N900 Died Replaced with N8, Requested E7, "Accidentally Broke E7", Now rolling with an N9 and im loving it!


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wmarone is offline wmarone
2011-05-26 , 22:00
Posts: 1,746 | Thanked: 2,100 times | Joined on Sep 2009
#158
Originally Posted by woody14619 View Post
I won't answer... I'll let the Nokia-hosted MeeGo conference about N900 DE explain it for me:

Please read line one aloud: "This is and will not be for regular end users." Period. You can read the whole text and see more slides by clicking here.
I don't need to. I was there.

Even the presenter, near the end of the demo video, notes that the camera still has issues, and overall "it needs work... But is surprisingly overall good." Not exactly a ringing endorsement.
You've just done the same thing. You've said "It can't ever be good" but not given any reasons. The DE is not intended for regular end users. It can be a base from which a version for regular end users could be developed, however. Yet the question, which still has not been answered, is why this is not possible.

It's certainly more possible than getting the last closed bits out of Nokia.

And NITDroid is Android, which IMO can't compare to MeeGo or Maemo, no matter how hard they try (never mind the fact that Android will never work with any of the closed bits required for hardware support, due to Google using a custom libc.)
 
godofwar424 is offline godofwar424
2011-05-26 , 22:14
Posts: 1,320 | Thanked: 915 times | Joined on Feb 2010
#159
Originally Posted by wmarone View Post
And NITDroid is Android, which IMO can't compare to MeeGo or Maemo, no matter how hard they try (never mind the fact that Android will never work with any of the closed bits required for hardware support, due to Google using a custom libc.)
You keep repeating yourself. Why must you be right all the time?

You have a very clear inability to take other peoples opinions. Who are you to say fixing maemo is pointless and that MeeGo is the future for the N900?

Maemo works NOW as an end usable platform, with the source code, the final tweaks and bugs can be fixed making maemo complete for us using our N900's.

MeeGo is going to, at best. take 6 months+ to get to even a PR 1.0 status for end users. Whereas Maemo could be almost perfect within a couple of months.

Just understand that NOBODY is saying MeeGo is crap or worse then Maemo. Just that atm it cannot compete with ANY mobile platform purely because its still really in alpha stages.
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Well Nokia do at least know how to build a decent phone, just apparently don't know how to support it..

N900 Died Replaced with N8, Requested E7, "Accidentally Broke E7", Now rolling with an N9 and im loving it!


My Contributions

N900 Conversations Wiki Page
 

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momcilo is offline momcilo
2011-05-26 , 22:25
Posts: 673 | Thanked: 856 times | Joined on Mar 2006
#160
Originally Posted by godofwar424 View Post
You keep repeating yourself. Why must you be right all the time?

You have a very clear inability to take other peoples opinions. Who are you to say fixing maemo is pointless and that MeeGo is the future for the N900?

Maemo works NOW as an end usable platform, with the source code, the final tweaks and bugs can be fixed making maemo complete for us using our N900's.

MeeGo is going to, at best. take 6 months+ to get to even a PR 1.0 status for end users. Whereas Maemo could be almost perfect within a couple of months.

Just understand that NOBODY is saying MeeGo is crap or worse then Maemo. Just that atm it cannot compete with ANY mobile platform purely because its still really in alpha stages.
Personally, I've always disliked meego. The main reason being ugly rpm based packaging system. I've always preferred emerge and debs, and having installed meego 1.1 on asus 1005 Hag has shown how slow rpm is compared to debs (running on n810).

The debate weather the maemo is to be abandoned in favour of meego is pointless. The important thing is to make vendors stop abusing open source projects by limiting them through critical closed sourced code pieces (drivers, daemons, and similar).
 

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