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Firefox with Leste (10)
to Maemo 7 / Leste by teroyk - 3 days, 6 hrs ago - more...
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2010-05-06
, 22:22
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Posts: 1,751 |
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Joined on Feb 2010
@ Sweden
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#12
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1. By the year 2015 a lot of people will have heard of Linux and are opting to try it out.
2. within 5 years...
3. Conservatism... you know what you have but not what you get. I think it will mainly be a generation thingy. So personalization is important.
4. Ubuntu.. no one els is as stable and complete. And it's easier than Windows. Got my brother to try it out when his Vista died for the second time. I put up a dual boot with Ubuntu and Win7. I showed him the basic stuff.. Now he want me to uninstall win7. Just haven't had time to do it.
Windows will be free of charge eventually and so the office package.. but in the long run it will fail. The browser war is a good example of that. Freedom, extendability and personalization is the winner there.
Last edited by AlMehdi; 2010-05-06 at 22:29.
2. within 5 years...
3. Conservatism... you know what you have but not what you get. I think it will mainly be a generation thingy. So personalization is important.
4. Ubuntu.. no one els is as stable and complete. And it's easier than Windows. Got my brother to try it out when his Vista died for the second time. I put up a dual boot with Ubuntu and Win7. I showed him the basic stuff.. Now he want me to uninstall win7. Just haven't had time to do it.
Windows will be free of charge eventually and so the office package.. but in the long run it will fail. The browser war is a good example of that. Freedom, extendability and personalization is the winner there.
Last edited by AlMehdi; 2010-05-06 at 22:29.
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2010-05-06
, 22:26
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Posts: 11,700 |
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Joined on Jun 2006
@ North Texas, USA
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#13
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Thread moved. Linux technology is relevant to Maemo so this is topical.
Feel free to start thanking each other.
Feel free to start thanking each other.
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Different <> Wrong | Listen - Judgment = Progress | People + Trust = Success
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2010-05-06
, 22:26
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Banned |
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Joined on Jan 2010
@ Vancouver
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#14
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If you are talking about desktop operating systems the answer is never. In the server room and on embedded devices it's already there.
Edit: I shouldn't say never. If someone takes a Unix system, stops the design by comittee, and manages to solve all the bugs that normal people (grandma) would run into and be unable to solve, while developing grandma usable software that can compete with the offerings available on windows it's possible. See MacOS X as an example of how to do this correctly. Until then it will remain the tool or server admins, developers and hobbyists, and never see mainstream acceptance.
Last edited by ZShakespeare; 2010-05-06 at 22:35.
Edit: I shouldn't say never. If someone takes a Unix system, stops the design by comittee, and manages to solve all the bugs that normal people (grandma) would run into and be unable to solve, while developing grandma usable software that can compete with the offerings available on windows it's possible. See MacOS X as an example of how to do this correctly. Until then it will remain the tool or server admins, developers and hobbyists, and never see mainstream acceptance.
Last edited by ZShakespeare; 2010-05-06 at 22:35.
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2010-05-06
, 22:31
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Posts: 11,700 |
Thanked: 10,045 times |
Joined on Jun 2006
@ North Texas, USA
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#15
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Originally Posted by ZShakespeare
And for mobile: very soon.
If you are talking about desktop operating systems the answer is never. In the server room and on embedded devices it's already there.
__________________
Nokia Developer Champion
Different <> Wrong | Listen - Judgment = Progress | People + Trust = Success
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Different <> Wrong | Listen - Judgment = Progress | People + Trust = Success
My personal site: http://texrat.net
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2010-05-06
, 22:33
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Posts: 670 |
Thanked: 747 times |
Joined on Aug 2009
@ Kansas City, Missouri, USA
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#16
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Originally Posted by roundyz
What I said. Agree completely. Ordinary people would change, eventually, for something better. Business not just won't - it can't.
The biggest problem linux faces is business.
Most businesses wont touch free software because of the lack of liability associated with it.
In business, everyone often needs to use the same software in order to have interoperability or just simply communicate. Try to run a business sending documents in anything but Word or Excel. Ain't happenin'. And that's just simple documents.
Software packages deployed over many locations and many businesses have to be written for a single OS or companies have huge support headaches. That's why even OS-X has near zero support in business software.
...people...over estimate the scale that it's deployment is at. If you then compare this to the reality; many many more machines have windows versions on. Its hard to admit this for a geek...its harder to realise that its entirely likely this won't change.
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2010-05-06
, 22:38
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Posts: 1,751 |
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Joined on Feb 2010
@ Sweden
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#17
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Originally Posted by roundyz
This is not entirely true.. Most big businesses develop their own programs so here it would not be a problem. The nasdaq stock exchange moved to linux because of it's stability and so are other businesses.
The biggest problem linux faces is business. Most businesses wont touch free software because of the lack of liability associated with it. And this is important as businesses need to report the failures. Sure you can get support packages from vendors, but the linux thing is too small to contend. The other issue is that people that use it are caught up in it and over estimate the scale that it's deployment is at. If you then compare this to the reality; many many more machines have windows versions on. Its hard to admit this for a geek (I have used linux for around 10 years now, and I love it to bits...), its harder to realise that its entirely likely this won't change.
Small companies will take longer but they will get there too. Too much money to save here. I know a couple of companies who are opting for it but haven't decided yet. Next time they need to upgrade.
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2010-05-06
, 22:41
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Posts: 733 |
Thanked: 991 times |
Joined on Dec 2008
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#18
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Originally Posted by Crashdamage
On another note, that is why Apple will never see wide-spread deployment in the enterprise. They have some tools, there is people that will bring their Macs to the office and will get to work there, but supporting enterprises is a massive undertaking, one that Apple has nor the infrastructure or the wish to go in (they have enough with the consumer market I think).
What I said. Agree completely. Ordinary people would change, eventually, for something better. Business not just won't - it can't.
Disagree, mostly. They would be more open to OSS, but ya gotta have standardization.
In business, everyone often needs to use the same software in order to have interoperability or just simply communicate. Try to run a business sending documents in anything but Word or Excel. Ain't happenin'. And that's just simple documents.
Software packages deployed over many locations and many businesses have to be written for a single OS or companies have huge support headaches. That's why even OS-X has near zero support in business software.
Exactly.
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Hola! Soy un Guía de Maemo!.
Vínculos interesantes si nos visitas por primera vez (en inglés): New members say hello , New users start here, Community subforum, Beginners' wiki page, Maemo5 101, Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
Si te puedo ayudar con cualquier otra cosa, sólo dilo!
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2010-05-06
, 22:43
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Posts: 1,751 |
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Joined on Feb 2010
@ Sweden
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#19
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Originally Posted by ZShakespeare
My father are running Ubuntu without problems and he do not understand anything about computers. He just use internet and email. My mother was against it at first but doesn't say much about it now. My brother have changed as his Vista machine died on him. So linux is not only for tech savvy ppl.
If you are talking about desktop operating systems the answer is never. In the server room and on embedded devices it's already there.
Edit: I shouldn't say never. If someone takes a Unix system, stops the design by comittee, and manages to solve all the bugs that normal people (grandma) would run into and be unable to solve, while developing grandma usable software that can compete with the offerings available on windows it's possible. See MacOS X as an example of how to do this correctly. Until then it will remain the tool or server admins, developers and hobbyists, and never see mainstream acceptance.
Edit: ohh.. but my wife is still a windows user. Have not been able to convince her to try yet
Last edited by AlMehdi; 2010-05-06 at 22:49.
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2010-05-06
, 23:01
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Posts: 73 |
Thanked: 11 times |
Joined on Nov 2009
@ uk
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#20
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Originally Posted by Venemo
Like what? Decent is relevent only to preference. Do you mean tools? (if so, there are lots...)
AND it will have a decent development platorm.
Originally Posted by Venemo
Yerh, just like when it creeped into debian a while back;changed the world then....
2) Almost complete lack of top-of-the-line development environments and platform.
Most people who develop for Linux still argue about whether to use C or C++ (or some weird interpreted scripting language), while development is WAY easier on Windows.
2/a) While actually, anyone can create a stunning UI for WPF in no time, Linux developers usually assemble their UI with tools similar to (but less functional than) VB6's form editor from 10 years ago. Or WORSE, they create the UI from code.
(Although Qt's QML looks very promising.)
2/b) Most people consider Java and .NET properitary crap not worth caring about, any of the two offers faster, easier and friendlier development experience than native code.
Not to mention that I can run the same code (without recompiling) on any architecture, with the promise of being optimized for that, too.
[I](Fortunately, Mono is going to change that one day.)
People who program for operating systems including Microsoft use c and c++. Its the right speed for the job. And at OS level you see no .net crap. Thats ms not eating thier own dog food.
However Java has other merits and shouldn't be tared with the same brush, they are both languages normally used for business apps.
What would you consider top of the line development environments? Mine is vim, web browser, compiler and a build tool:make or ant.
Average people won't, because there is no such thing as "Linux", there are 100s of distributions, all of them claiming to be the right one, and all of them containing different set of bugs.
AND it will have a decent development platorm.
BTW, on launching Firefox, it gave me a kernel panic. No, thanks.
I'll wait and see.
Well, I think this is the part really worth discussing:
Most of the Linux people hate the competing distributions more than they hate Windows, for no real reason.
1/a) There is no "Linux" operating system, just hundreds of "distributions", none of which are complete, and all of them claims that is is the best.
It is hard to choose, and after trying out 2 of them (Ubuntu and Fedora) which were equally as buggy, I just didn't bother.
1/b) One of the most important people behind it keeps on arguing about the name of the OS, which is understandable from a personal viewpoint, but it just confuses the average people.
2) Almost complete lack of top-of-the-line development environments and platform.
Most people who develop for Linux still argue about whether to use C or C++ (or some weird interpreted scripting language), while development is WAY easier on Windows.
2/a) While actually, anyone can create a stunning UI for WPF in no time, Linux developers usually assemble their UI with tools similar to (but less functional than) VB6's form editor from 10 years ago. Or WORSE, they create the UI from code.
(Although Qt's QML looks very promising.)
2/b) Most people consider Java and .NET properitary crap not worth caring about, any of the two offers faster, easier and friendlier development experience than native code.
Not to mention that I can run the same code (without recompiling) on any architecture, with the promise of being optimized for that, too.
(Fortunately, Mono is going to change that one day.)
That's it.
All of the above is my personal opinion, and I don't intend to offend and flame anyone with it. If you disagree or think I'm uninformed, I'll be glad if you correct me.
And BTW, I love the freedom that Linux promises (this is why I bought the N900, after all), but I can't use it for any work on my PC.
You should follow me on Twitter!
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Last edited by Venemo; 2010-05-06 at 22:25.