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	benny1967	2009-10-23 , 10:18
	Posts: 3,790 \| Thanked: 5,718 times \| Joined on Mar 2006 @ Vienna, Austria	#11

I'm not sure if the observation is right in the first place. If the question is about software for Maemo and getting developers to write for Maemo, I think it's a pretty impressive success story.

Don't forget that Maemo hasn't been available on mass market devices so far. Also, there's no "app store" where you could make money from applications. So what you could realistically hope for is that those who own a Maemo device may eventually develop/port what they need for themselves and make it available for the public.

We have ~500 applications now. That's plenty. Really. If I go to the Ovi Store with my S60v3 device, I get ~1000 Applications (including games). Now compare the number of S30v3 devices sold to that of Maemo devices... And add to that the fact that people who publish @ovi.com can make money from their applications...

My impression is we have a much broader range of software available than one should expect in this niche market. Don't forget that when application stores for other platforms list 10.000 apps, you can safely assume there's always 500 of them that do the same thing with a different UI. We may have only one or two apps for a specific task, but that's better than having 500 applications that make your N810 fart in stereo.

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geneven	2009-10-23 , 10:33
Posts: 5,795 \| Thanked: 3,151 times \| Joined on Feb 2007 @ Agoura Hills Calif	#12

Because no one has heard of Maemo and they don't understand the concept?

Because the masterful PR campaign for the term "Maemo" has yet to be launched from the bold, resourceful, media-savvy developers here, who have launched so many erratically capitalized terms and their experience is about to sweep the world? In two weeks Maemo will be on the front page of every newspaper in the galaxy and you will have to chase developers away with a stick. People will be naming their first-born Maemo, especially useful for people named John Brown who used to differentiate themselves with the middle name of Heironymus -- now it wll be John Maemo Brown!

Sorry...

Last edited by geneven; 2009-10-23 at 10:35.

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matthewcc	2009-10-23 , 10:35
Posts: 267 \| Thanked: 128 times \| Joined on Sep 2009 @ Somerville MA - USA	#13

Originally Posted by benny1967

My impression is we have a much broader range of software available than one should expect in this niche market. Don't forget that when application stores for other platforms list 10.000 apps, you can safely assume there's always 500 of them that do the same thing with a different UI. We may have only one or two apps for a specific task, but that's better than having 500 applications that make your N810 fart in stereo.

I actually like the idea that I am not 'stuck' with one app to do something. I agree that I would like to not have 500 fart apps, but I won't complain about having 5 media players to choose from or 10 im clients.

I hate that we talk about the n900 as a niche product, If you consider "smart phone" a niche then sure. BUT software will determine what sub smart device niche this device can fall into.

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attila77	2009-10-23 , 10:48
Posts: 3,319 \| Thanked: 5,610 times \| Joined on Aug 2008 @ Finland	#14

Originally Posted by matthewcc

I actually like the idea that I am not 'stuck' with one app to do something. I agree that I would like to not have 500 fart apps, but I won't complain about having 5 media players to choose from or 10 im clients.

For the record, there are well over 5 media players for Maemo. You won't (and shouldn't) see 10 IM clients as the N900 conceptually doesn't deal with 'clients', it's all sort of plugin-ish. You don't even have Skype as a separate application, and I think it's a fantastic approach compared to the million-apps-for-a-million-sites approach of the iPhone.

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BatPenguin	2009-10-23 , 10:51
Posts: 177 \| Thanked: 128 times \| Joined on Jan 2008 @ Espoo, Finland	#15

Originally Posted by benny1967

We may have only one or two apps for a specific task, but that's better than having 500 applications that make your N810 fart in stereo.

Why do the fart apps always need to be mentioned? If there's silly and outright stupid apps among the tens of thousands of apps available for a platform, it doesn't mean that there wouldn't be plenty of useful ones too.

Originally Posted by benny1967

Don't forget that when application stores for other platforms list 10.000 apps, you can safely assume there's always 500 of them that do the same thing with a different UI.

Nonsense. So what, Android has 20 unique apps?

There's plenty of apps for the same thing, yes. But there's also plenty of apps for things not available on Maemo.

There's more apps for these other platforms, period. Also, why would it be bad to have lots of choice about what type of application for use X to install? When I got my Android phone, I looked at the available RSS feed readers (plenty, as you can imagine. No, not quite 500), installed 3 or 4 of them and kept the one I liked the best. Does that sound a bad thing? I was actually very happy about this since I've never liked the N810 RSS reader and I'm actually quite picky about how I want it to look, etc. I found a nice one.

Admitting the facts (as in, Maemo does NOT have as good a selection in apps as the other platform) might be a good starting point for improving the situation. It really doesn't accomplish anything to claim that the other platforms don't have any good ones available and to claim that the other app stores / markets are not any better. They are, admit it. The selection of apps (both unique apps and apps that do the same thing) is better on those other platforms at the moment. Looking forward to the day when the situation is more equal.

Also: code a fart app. Please. That'd be fun.

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attila77	2009-10-23 , 10:56
Posts: 3,319 \| Thanked: 5,610 times \| Joined on Aug 2008 @ Finland	#16

And as for the commercial app developer draw people talked about - it won't happen, not in the way you visualize. A lot of people want the SAME developers who are devoted to a business model NOT present on Maemo to come over and develop for it. That won't happen. Many draw the conclusion that this means niche devices and markets, but this is not necessarily true. The point is you have to spread ALTERNATIVE BUSINESS CONCEPTS of how to monetize on Maemo, which DO exist. Currently users are mindblocked on the Almighty Appstore and see that as the only possible way of commercial development (and the developers there the only mindshare to capture).

Maemo CAN do something revolutionary with regard how business is done on mobile app development. But lock it in a Appstore lookalike and you are suddenly no different than any other manufacturer trying to make it's own App-me-too-store.

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	benny1967	2009-10-23 , 10:57
	Posts: 3,790 \| Thanked: 5,718 times \| Joined on Mar 2006 @ Vienna, Austria	#17

Originally Posted by matthewcc

I actually like the idea that I am not 'stuck' with one app to do something. I agree that I would like to not have 500 fart apps, but I won't complain about having 5 media players to choose from or 10 im clients.

http://maemo.org/downloads/OS2008/multimedia/
count the media players. I think you'll have 5.

Originally Posted by matthewcc

I hate that we talk about the n900 as a niche product, If you consider "smart phone" a niche then sure. BUT software will determine what sub smart device niche this device can fall into.

In my post I referred to the pre-N900 devices. You shouldn't seriously expect any development for the N900, a device that's not even released. (The fact that, in spite of this, we do have an impressive number of applications ready and waiting to be installed by end users shows how far ahaed Maemo actually is.)

Pre-N900 devices certainly were niche products. (And I think a niche product is something positive. The masses aren't too bright, niche products are for those who are able and willing to deal with more power and complexity than the average consumer.)

It will depend on the marketing, but I believe the N900 will not be a mass market product, either. It's still too weak on the phone side, it cannot compete with smartphones like Nokia's own S60 models. Not a lot of customers will replace their current expensive smartphone with an even more expensive device that can do less. The niche may not be quite as small as it was for the N8x0, but it'll probably still be a niche.

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ddalex	2009-10-23 , 11:00
Posts: 90 \| Thanked: 32 times \| Joined on Sep 2006 @ Bucuresti, Romania	#18

Originally Posted by benny1967

We have ~500 applications now. That's plenty. Really. If I go to the Ovi Store with my S60v3 device, I get ~1000 Applications (including games). Now compare the number of S30v3 devices sold to that of Maemo devices... And add to that the fact that people who publish @ovi.com can make money from their applications...

Well, let's look at the most succesfull aplications for Maemo 4, and we'll see nothing ground breaking, but apps that are considered "must have" system enhancements on a smartphone or Linux computer and that come already embedded in the most cases on Android. Specifically, top apps are: Personal Menu, Power Monitor, Weather widget, Media Player, Mapper, SSH, Mplayer, Instant messaging, More Media Player, System Monitor, WifiInfo, Sound Recorder, More media players.... I don't know how to emphasize this, but there are NO applications that let you DO nice things on Maemo apart from monitoring the system and consume media.

We don't have groundbreaking work as Layar because... what exactly ? Why students with reseach projects don't embrace Maemo and publish software on it ? What other great software apart from liqbase do we have on Maemo ? What is that the Maemo is missing to enhance its appeal to innovators, and how can we ammend that ?

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	benny1967	2009-10-23 , 11:03
	Posts: 3,790 \| Thanked: 5,718 times \| Joined on Mar 2006 @ Vienna, Austria	#19

Originally Posted by BatPenguin

Admitting the facts (as in, Maemo does NOT have as good a selection in apps as the other platform) might be a good starting point for improving the situation.

Reading a post before wring a reply like that might be a good starting point, too.

I didn't say Maemo has as much applications as other platforms.

I said that given the fact that Maemo lives in a niche market (whereas Android is a mass market thing), the selection of applications is surprisingly good. You just cannot compare the two and expect to find as many apps in Maemo Extras as in the Android store.