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weatherman is offline weatherman
2007-12-02 , 01:20
Posts: 56 | Thanked: 12 times | Joined on Nov 2007 @ Brooklyn, NY
#11
Originally Posted by sevo View Post
To have a location sensitive map? Even bare coordinate data were very useful when combined with a paper map, and all you could expect from early GPS devices.
Yes, I've used those. Early GPSs were good for hikers who needed to know where they were in the wilderness. Finding out your lat/long or location on a map without any information about how to get where you want to go is far less useful. Maybe you've got a need to get an overview of where you are and see particular POI's in the vicinity - and I admit this can be useful when traveling and when looking for the hotspots listed in the maps provided in the n810 now, but right now for my needs the GPS is a pointless and expensive afterthought in the n810. Just like the camera is.

Originally Posted by Karel Jansens View Post
I can use the virtual thumbboard on the N800 in almost exactly the same way as one would use the hardware thumbboard on a N810.
Whatever floats your boat as well. I loathe virtual keyboards and type much slower on them than real keyboards. I like my n810, and would certainly recommend it to anyone who felt like I do about software keyboards. But don't misunderstand what I was saying - I was not recommending the n810 over the n800 so much as pointing out the weaknesses of using a BT keyboard.
Originally Posted by Karel Jansens View Post
I heard this rumour that it's not true that the N810 has a transflexive screen, only a brighter backlight to make it look better in daylight. If so: Har, har, har on your superior screen!
I never said the n810 had a transflective screen, and I very specifically <i>did</i> say that I can't compare it to an n800 screen because I've never used one. But I stand by what I did say, which is that the n810 screen is very good and readable in sunlight like my old HP iPaq 1910 (with transflective screen) used to be.
Originally Posted by Karel Jansens View Post
Again, Bluetooth to the rescue! Nobody wants a built-in GPS, if an external BT unit can be had that's small enough to hang from your keys.
Again, you seem to have taken what I said in the wrong way. I don't know how I could be any clearer: the inclusion of GPS on the n810 clearly makes it more expensive, and in my opinion there is little value in that extra cost. So don't act like you scored a >zing<
Originally Posted by Karel Jansens View Post
Or... a Psion Netbook
Psion Netbooks were interesting back in 2000 when they came out. Now they're outdated. That old OS chugs along with no support for a wireless standard that had barely been invented at that point. It's going to provide loads of fun in tinkering time trying to configure it to work with existing hardware and software. And though it may have memory card slots, good luck finding anything that will work in them - drivers are going to be few, and there will not be support for high-capacity memory cards. The screen is a crappy old STN screen that has response times like my grandma on lithium. No support for anything web 2.0. Never mind the issues of replacement batteries and out-of-warranty repairs... I could go on. Sure, if you're a tinkerer and like those old machines, or just want to find something to hack out a doc you might be able to use the Psion Netbook, but I would consider it a waste of money at nearly any price.
 
Karel Jansens's Avatar
Karel Jansens is offline Karel Jansens
2007-12-02 , 02:09
Posts: 3,220 | Thanked: 326 times | Joined on Oct 2005 @ "Almost there!" (Monte Christo, Count of)
#12
Originally Posted by weatherman View Post
Psion Netbooks were interesting back in 2000 when they came out. Now they're outdated. That old OS chugs along with no support for a wireless standard that had barely been invented at that point. It's going to provide loads of fun in tinkering time trying to configure it to work with existing hardware and software. And though it may have memory card slots, good luck finding anything that will work in them - drivers are going to be few, and there will not be support for high-capacity memory cards. The screen is a crappy old STN screen that has response times like my grandma on lithium. No support for anything web 2.0. Never mind the issues of replacement batteries and out-of-warranty repairs... I could go on. Sure, if you're a tinkerer and like those old machines, or just want to find something to hack out a doc you might be able to use the Psion Netbook, but I would consider it a waste of money at nearly any price.
In fact, the latest (last?) build of the OS has finished drivers for ethernet and WiFi. The PCMCIA slot is indeed outdated, and will not accept cardbus cards, but the CF slot is identical to that of my Series 5MX, and that old thing took a 1 gig CF card without a hickup. There is no such thing as a "HC" CF standard, they all work.

I consider the absense of Web 2.0 support a bonus, but mostly the operating system, user interface and built in applications are of a superior standard.
 
gemniii42 is offline gemniii42
2007-12-02 , 03:53
Posts: 833 | Thanked: 124 times | Joined on Nov 2007 @ Based in the USA
#13
Proud owner of an 810.
Decision points:
At decision time the 800 cost $240, the 810 $410.
GPS was required, either way, at that time about $50
Keyboard required, at that time a BT kb was $80.
So $370 was about what I was looking at for an 800 w GPS and kb.

However-the 800 dropped to $200, and I bought a stowaway for $30. This would have dropped the price to $280 a definite winner.

I disagree with weathermans dump on the BT kb. My stowaway
easily fits on my leg as I type.
 
Malfaiteur is offline Malfaiteur
2007-12-02 , 04:17
Posts: 27 | Thanked: 0 times | Joined on Nov 2007 @ Greensboro, NC
#14
Originally Posted by gemniii42 View Post
Proud owner of an 810.
Decision points:
At decision time the 800 cost $240, the 810 $410.
GPS was required, either way, at that time about $50
Keyboard required, at that time a BT kb was $80.
So $370 was about what I was looking at for an 800 w GPS and kb.

However-the 800 dropped to $200, and I bought a stowaway for $30. This would have dropped the price to $280 a definite winner.

I disagree with weathermans dump on the BT kb. My stowaway
easily fits on my leg as I type.
Where does the tablet go when you balance your keyboard on your lap? Sounds like things are getting precarious there. I bought an N810 but it hasn't shipped yet and I'm thinking of canceling and buying an N800. I also have a BT keyboard on the way as I want to do some lengthier typing now and then. I initially thought the hardware kb would be better for casual use surfing and notes etc., but now I'm not so sure it will be that much help.

I don't use GPS. Not a Geo cacher or a hiker. I don't worry about getting lost much during travel, it's part of the fun ...usually. So I think that if the tablet doesn't ship on Monday then I'm going to cancel the order and get in on a cheaper deal. The N800 seems a little better for media based on some comparison points I have heard. Flash is a little jittery on it right now, but OS2008 will fix that no?

Side bar, what's with the camera anyway? On either tablet it doesn't seem to do much and when it does, it doesn't do it very well. Is this a software/driver issue or is the camera just poo? Useful for skype I suppose; too bad I don't skype.

Yet.

~!M
 
Malfaiteur is offline Malfaiteur
2007-12-02 , 04:19
Posts: 27 | Thanked: 0 times | Joined on Nov 2007 @ Greensboro, NC
#15
Originally Posted by Karel Jansens View Post
In fact, the latest (last?) build of the OS has finished drivers for ethernet and WiFi. The PCMCIA slot is indeed outdated, and will not accept cardbus cards, but the CF slot is identical to that of my Series 5MX, and that old thing took a 1 gig CF card without a hickup. There is no such thing as a "HC" CF standard, they all work.

I consider the absense of Web 2.0 support a bonus, but mostly the operating system, user interface and built in applications are of a superior standard.
I do honestly mean this, what makes it better in your opinion? Time, of course, does not always equate to progress, but 7 years is a long time in computer speak..surely things are somewhat better now?

~!M
 
weatherman's Avatar
weatherman is offline weatherman
2007-12-02 , 05:00
Posts: 56 | Thanked: 12 times | Joined on Nov 2007 @ Brooklyn, NY
#16
Originally Posted by gemniii42 View Post
I disagree with weathermans dump on the BT kb. My stowaway easily fits on my leg as I type.
Not really a "dump" - I own one and think it has a purpose. But it's more hassle than just sliding out the keyboard on the n810. Of which I am also a proud owner.
Originally Posted by Malfaiteur View Post
I bought an N810 but it hasn't shipped yet and I'm thinking of canceling and buying an N800... I initially thought the hardware kb would be better for casual use surfing and notes etc., but now I'm not so sure it will be that much help.
I'm not sure that I'd cancel. In fact, I had the same option and I chose not to. I can't say that the n810 provides $200 worth of extra value at the moment but I kept my order because I think over time it will. And certainly for the moment the keyboard is handy for casual surfing and notes. As Karel points out there's always the virtual-keyboard, but I can't get by with that. I say keep your order, and return it if you don't see the value. I'm keepin' mine.

Originally Posted by Karel Jansens View Post
In fact, the latest (last?) build of the OS has finished drivers for ethernet and WiFi.
I stand somewhat corrected then.

Originally Posted by Karel Jansens View Post
I consider the absense [sic] of Web 2.0 support a bonus, but mostly the operating system, user interface and built in applications are of a superior standard.
That's a little nuts, no? Not being angle to handle flickr, facebook, youtube or any flash site isn't a disadvantage? Superior standard? I don't get that at all.
 
pwsn is offline pwsn
2007-12-02 , 08:13
Posts: 39 | Thanked: 4 times | Joined on Dec 2007
#17
Thanks for the good info everyone.

Originally Posted by weatherman View Post
But if it's a laptop replacement you're looking for, pwsn, you might be better served by the Eee PC. That seems much more likely to meet your needs than the n800/810 which are really more web and entertainment devices than laptop replacement machines.
When I said laptop alternative I meant in terms of portability. Right now I use my desktop mainly for IM, email, browsing. Would be nice to do all that without turning on a computer and where ever there's wifi. Going back to school in May and should suit the bill alright. Don't write a lot of papers for school and if I have to type anything longer I could throw a bt keyboard in my bag.

I'm pretty set on the N800 right now. GPS would be nice to play around with. But if i could load a map onto the N800 that'll do me just fine.
 
DingerX is offline DingerX
2007-12-02 , 11:50
Posts: 72 | Thanked: 9 times | Joined on Sep 2007
#18
Most people who start these sorts of threads are already sold. No you're not making a mistake.

I have a n800 with the ThinkOutside Stowaway. It's cool, but it has two annoyances:
1. The keyboard Stttutteeerrsssss. It will sometimes decide to transmit multiple keypresses instead of just one.
2. The layout is suboptimal. Placing the uparrow and question mark on the same key, for example, is asking for trouble. Hit a shift-uparrow for a question mark, and let go of the shift before uparrow, and the keyboard decides to move you up a line (or with stutter, several lines). If you're touch-typing, you won't notice that you're now inserting text several lines up.

Also, a built-in thumbboard would be very handy in many situations.

GPS is not an everyday necessity, but I have been surprised by the utility of having a BT GPS unit.
The camera really isn't useful for much yet; video calls are cooler than I thought they'd be, especially since you don't have to be parked in one place to make them.
 
Malfaiteur is offline Malfaiteur
2007-12-02 , 12:17
Posts: 27 | Thanked: 0 times | Joined on Nov 2007 @ Greensboro, NC
#19
Originally Posted by weatherman View Post
I'm not sure that I'd cancel. In fact, I had the same option and I chose not to. I can't say that the n810 provides $200 worth of extra value at the moment but I kept my order because I think over time it will. And certainly for the moment the keyboard is handy for casual surfing and notes. As Karel points out there's always the virtual-keyboard, but I can't get by with that. I say keep your order, and return it if you don't see the value. I'm keepin' mine.
You sound like a person who might very well dabble in futures.
What I wonder is will it be worth the $200 extra before it drops in price? I hadn't thought about it before but it's been mentioned on this thread and in others now that I think about it, but it seems the software kb doesn't always stick around to play nice. Not sure I'd be pleased with that if it started deciding to duck out and leave me hanging with no way to enter txt
 
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Karel Jansens is offline Karel Jansens
2007-12-02 , 12:40
Posts: 3,220 | Thanked: 326 times | Joined on Oct 2005 @ "Almost there!" (Monte Christo, Count of)
#20
Originally Posted by weatherman View Post
That's a little nuts, no? Not being angle to handle flickr, facebook, youtube or any flash site isn't a disadvantage? Superior standard? I don't get that at all.
It may be that we are of a slightly different generation then, because none of the things you mention has ever managed to float my boat. I kinda like online (office) applications, in the way someone likes a slightly ******ed puppy, but I've never used one in a serious matter. The only exception is Google mail, but that's only because email is mostly entertainment for me these days. If I ever needed it in a business-like capacity again, I'd so offline my mail immediately.

Psion's EPOC operating system and applications are a bit like the NewtonOS: They're almost perfect, incredibly adapted to the devices they're running on and so easy to use, one almost forgets about them.

For six years, a Psion Series 3a was my main business computer. And by that I mean everything was on that little scamp. I had a Canon Bubblejet thrown on the back seat of my car and that was it. Granted, this was in the days before Internet and email.
 
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