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daperl is offline daperl
2009-11-11 , 23:05
Posts: 2,427 | Thanked: 2,986 times | Joined on Dec 2007
#11
Originally Posted by mcv View Post
It seems to me that the N900, great though in some hardware areas, is lacking a bit in other areas.
If there was a perfect device, I'm confident we here at talk.maemo.org would know about it. Consider this a journey.

I'm also afraid I'll end up with a bare Linux desktop rather than a smooth and slick smartphone with lots of cool apps accessible with only a single click.
Yes, Nokia and this community are hiding all the apps. And if anyone tries to put them on their desktop we will shoot them.

(I don't want to browse through menus to find the app I want.)
When? When you're looking for new apps, or when you're looking for already installed apps. If the former, it's no different than any where else. If the latter, see above.

Then again, Maemo also seems to have a smart, active and dedicated community, and that's worth something too.
It can be worth plenty. It's been invaluable for me and I'm reasonably capable.

Welcome, but know thyself and lose your fear.
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mcv is offline mcv
2009-11-11 , 23:08
Posts: 7 | Thanked: 0 times | Joined on Nov 2009 @ Amsterdam
#12
Originally Posted by ewan View Post
Ask yourself what you'd rather have on a desktop computer:
a) - a precise mouse pointer as is normal,
or
b) a system that uses circular pointers a couple of inches across that indiscriminately select everything underneath them when you click, but allows you to have two of them at once.

If you went for option 'a' why would you want something different on your mobile computer?
Because my desk has room for a mouse. When I'm outside, I tend to use my fingers to manipulate stuff.

I have used a WinMo phone with stylus, and although it worked, it didn't do for me what my iPhone did. It means you have to actively focus on it and use both hands to use it. I want a pocket computer that I can use with one hand while doing other stuff.
 
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2009-11-11 , 23:09
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#13
Originally Posted by ewan View Post
Ask yourself what you'd rather have on a desktop computer:
a) - a precise mouse pointer as is normal,
or
b) a system that uses circular pointers a couple of inches across that indiscriminately select everything underneath them when you click, but allows you to have two of them at once.

If you went for option 'a' why would you want something different on your mobile computer?
Props for this comparison.
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mrojas is offline mrojas
2009-11-11 , 23:11
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#14
Originally Posted by mcv View Post
Because my desk has room for a mouse. When I'm outside, I tend to use my fingers to manipulate stuff.

I have used a WinMo phone with stylus, and although it worked, it didn't do for me what my iPhone did. It means you have to actively focus on it and use both hands to use it. I want a pocket computer that I can use with one hand while doing other stuff.
Don't be confused: you don't require an stylus to use the N900. In fact, you don't require it for most resistive screens either. You may use it if you want. If you want to click on a tiny link on a webpage, you can double-tap and zoom to click it comfortably, OR pull out the stylus to click on it without zooming.

It's all about choices.
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franklinn is offline franklinn
2009-11-11 , 23:21
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#15
Let me tell you something, all this talk of apps isnpure drivel becausebita all about the service or rather cloud. Tell me, what app will you swap YouTube or gmaps for ? Apple likes to boast of it's app store size but They ignore that a good proportion of it's apps are just ebooks others Internet radio which are all available in my n810 via a sigle app. So you have 100000 apps, so what?. Its a scrap heap and with each additional rubbish app that gets added a gem is made harder to find
 
mcv is offline mcv
2009-11-11 , 23:24
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#16
Originally Posted by gwax View Post
Maemo offers the same (lack of) financial incentives that most other Linux platforms offer and presents the ability to run Linux applications natively. I have no idea how many applications there are for Linux but it's certainly competitive quality and quantity-wise with the iPhone and Android.
But likely most of them are designed for the desktop, not for a hand-held device. On a hand-held device, I want apps with big buttons that can be manipulated with big, fat, clumsy fingers.

Also, capacitive touchscreens do not respond well to non-fingers, which is a big plus for resistive in my book.
I think it'd be a minus for me. I always have my fingers with me, but I may not want it to respond to the fabric of my pocket when I quickly have to put it away without turning it off.

From the responses so far, I think the downsides boil down to:
  • many apps are designed to be used with stylus rather than fingers
  • no compass
  • no multi-touch

The big upside is:
  • I don't just own it, I control it.
also:
  • Community
  • Might be going places (or not).

Maemo does sound very interesting, and looks like something I'd want to be part of. But for practical use, perhaps I'd better try ordering a Milestone from Italy (they've got QWERTY keyboards there, apparently).
 
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mrojas is offline mrojas
2009-11-11 , 23:34
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#17
Originally Posted by mcv View Post
From the responses so far, I think the downsides boil down to:
  • many apps are designed to be used with stylus rather than fingers
  • no compass
  • no multi-touch
About this points:

In fact, I think the reverse is correct. Since the first announcement, the paradigm for developers was to focus on two things: finger-based use and always-connected state. Developers porting apps from previous Maemo releases or platforms are encouraged to go to that approach. Check some videos of the N900 in action, and you will notice how finger friendly is.

Yup, the dissection confirmed no compass.

There is no multi-touch, but really, think on this: since when multi-touch became a must-have UI requirement? It is one way of interacting with the device, not the only one.
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mcv is offline mcv
2009-11-11 , 23:37
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#18
Originally Posted by franklinn View Post
Let me tell you something, all this talk of apps isnpure drivel becausebita all about the service or rather cloud. Tell me, what app will you swap YouTube or gmaps for ? Apple likes to boast of it's app store size but They ignore that a good proportion of it's apps are just ebooks others Internet radio which are all available in my n810 via a sigle app. So you have 100000 apps, so what?
That's basically the most important point in any smartphone/pocket computer comparison. In the end, the value of the device is mostly in the apps that are available for it. And it's not about quantity either: one app that does it right is worth more than a hundred that get it wrong.

So what's right and wrong here? In my book, iPhone (and probably Android) has a big edge because their apps are designed for fat, clumsy fingers. iPhone has a big downside in that Apple is the gatekeeper for your apps, and if you want something that Apple doesn't want, you're out of luck. Android is a lot more open, but is it as open as Maemo? Or close enough, at least? I have no idea, really. iPhone has a lot of really crappy, useless apps, but it also has a lot of really great ones that do stuff I didn't know I wanted. (Locly is a favourite of mine, although it's not realtime enough and its interface is way too primitive). I have no idea if Android and Maemo have those same apps.

Maybe I should browse the Android and Maemo app stores before I make my decision. But if a lot of Maemo apps rely on the stylus, then I think Maemo is not for me.
 
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mrojas is offline mrojas
2009-11-11 , 23:40
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#19
BTW, since Maemo is open-source based, it doesn't have a store per se yet. It does have application repositories, and apps are also highlighted on the main maemo page. Feel free to browse around the application forums.
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ewan is offline ewan
2009-11-11 , 23:43
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#20
Originally Posted by mcv View Post
Because my desk has room for a mouse. When I'm outside, I tend to use my fingers to manipulate stuff.

I have used a WinMo phone with stylus, and although it worked, it didn't do for me what my iPhone did. It means you have to actively focus on it and use both hands to use it. I want a pocket computer that I can use with one hand while doing other stuff.
There's nothing about a resistive screen that means you have to use a stylus, it's just there if you need it. Most of the basic Maemo interface does use chunky finger friendly buttons, so for most one-handed uses I expect you'll be fine. On the other hand, if you need to use a non-native app (including a web app) that uses small widgets to fit a lot on the screen, then you have the option of a stylus. With pure capacitative you're just stuffed.

Also, can you really hold your iPhone in one hand while also using two of the fingers on the same hand as independent multitouch inputs?
 
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