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The N900 is now 15 years old! (8)
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tswindell |
2010-06-15
, 09:03
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Posts: 724 |
Thanked: 1,255 times |
Joined on Nov 2007
@ Cambridge, UK
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#11
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Originally Posted by attila77
Though I half agree with your analogy, Symbian and GNU/Linux are much different than two different versions of windows :P
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2010-06-15
, 09:19
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Posts: 478 |
Thanked: 101 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
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#12
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I think this thread should be sent to the top dogs at Nokia! This thread shows exactly why and how there business is going down hill.
The op asks a question and the first response is "get another phone", soon everyone WILL have another phone and will not be buying Nokia ever again, I will be one of those people. I love my N900 and all it's features but the bugs... I hoped these would have been sorted with PR1.2 and to be fair a number of them were fixed but this just gave rise to a new set of bugs. The fact that it took so long to release PR1.2 is a problem all on it's own but why didn't Nokia just say "we are sorting out x,y and z and the release date will be blah, If they had told us what to expect then we wouldn't be so upset with the result.
Nokia should be working more closely with this site, as I've said in a previous thread a part of me wishes that Nokia would just pack it all in, release the firmware code for the n900 and be done with the whole maemo deal. they obviously don't care so why bother keeping it from us, at least we could then fix our own problems (probably within a month) and the phone would become a legend!
Honestly if this is how Nokia work then why would any of us buy another phone from them? Im sure I will get shouted down as being a moaner but the only reason I do so is becasue it's such a simple problem for nokia to fix, as the OP says just a bit of team work from Nokia would make this such a better experience as apposed to me sat here wondering why my phone seems like it's been designed by 20 different people who have never even seen each other let alone had a conversation!
The op asks a question and the first response is "get another phone", soon everyone WILL have another phone and will not be buying Nokia ever again, I will be one of those people. I love my N900 and all it's features but the bugs... I hoped these would have been sorted with PR1.2 and to be fair a number of them were fixed but this just gave rise to a new set of bugs. The fact that it took so long to release PR1.2 is a problem all on it's own but why didn't Nokia just say "we are sorting out x,y and z and the release date will be blah, If they had told us what to expect then we wouldn't be so upset with the result.
Nokia should be working more closely with this site, as I've said in a previous thread a part of me wishes that Nokia would just pack it all in, release the firmware code for the n900 and be done with the whole maemo deal. they obviously don't care so why bother keeping it from us, at least we could then fix our own problems (probably within a month) and the phone would become a legend!
Honestly if this is how Nokia work then why would any of us buy another phone from them? Im sure I will get shouted down as being a moaner but the only reason I do so is becasue it's such a simple problem for nokia to fix, as the OP says just a bit of team work from Nokia would make this such a better experience as apposed to me sat here wondering why my phone seems like it's been designed by 20 different people who have never even seen each other let alone had a conversation!
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2010-06-15
, 09:28
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Posts: 619 |
Thanked: 691 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
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#13
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hey i am not a fanboy far from it - I think Nokia should reap the consequences of its actions and get punished in the marketplace severey - which will happen when ppl do not buy their phones.
regardless of WHOs fault it was, from the opening post it was clear (and correct if I am wrong) that the poster expected a phone that "just works"
n900 is NOT a phone that "just works" - regardless of which side of the n900 fence you are on.
even if a community volunteer fixes these bugs promptly, this is just a bandaid - the next bug comes along that doesnt get fixed promptly will just bring the opening poster back asking "dude where is my fix!"
the clear solution here is to align user expectation with the right product, and so the solution here is for the user to sell the n900 and get another phone that meets their needs. This is the ONLY solution that will solve the underlying problem, regardless of whether it is the user's fault for not doing homework or Nokia for misleading marketing.
again i repeat, the fundamental problem is that the poster has expectations that the product cannot provide, so the ONLY solution here is to sell your n900 and get a product that DOES fufil his requirements.
regardless of WHOs fault it was, from the opening post it was clear (and correct if I am wrong) that the poster expected a phone that "just works"
n900 is NOT a phone that "just works" - regardless of which side of the n900 fence you are on.
even if a community volunteer fixes these bugs promptly, this is just a bandaid - the next bug comes along that doesnt get fixed promptly will just bring the opening poster back asking "dude where is my fix!"
the clear solution here is to align user expectation with the right product, and so the solution here is for the user to sell the n900 and get another phone that meets their needs. This is the ONLY solution that will solve the underlying problem, regardless of whether it is the user's fault for not doing homework or Nokia for misleading marketing.
again i repeat, the fundamental problem is that the poster has expectations that the product cannot provide, so the ONLY solution here is to sell your n900 and get a product that DOES fufil his requirements.
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2010-06-15
, 09:36
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Posts: 2,829 |
Thanked: 1,459 times |
Joined on Dec 2009
@ Finland
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#14
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Frappacino,
If there were more salesmen like you customers would be much happier.
Last edited by slender; 2010-06-15 at 09:51.
If there were more salesmen like you customers would be much happier.
Last edited by slender; 2010-06-15 at 09:51.
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2010-06-15
, 09:44
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Posts: 1,259 |
Thanked: 1,341 times |
Joined on Oct 2009
@ Germany
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#15
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Originally Posted by attila77
In my opinion there is no reason to let a Symbian guy work for maemo. I don't want in the end a Symbian device. But to avoid the same mistakes other systems has done 10 years ago a consultant were a wise decision. Or simply look at a Symbian Device: "what have they done to solve this problem?"
Symbian and Maemo are different platforms. What you are saying is the equivalent of that Microsoft should reassign someone from the XBOX team to the Windows 7 team because some XBOX software is not working under Windows 7.
Why have maemo to reinvent the wheel at fundamental parts?
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2010-06-15
, 09:49
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Posts: 61 |
Thanked: 30 times |
Joined on Aug 2009
@ Madrid, Spain
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#16
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Originally Posted by Frappacino
So you are providing a solution that consists on selling the phone and getting another one that WORKS AS ADVERTISED (whichever brand it may be)??
hey i am not a fanboy far from it - I think Nokia should reap the consequences of its actions and get punished in the marketplace severey - which will happen when ppl do not buy their phones.
regardless of WHOs fault it was, from the opening post it was clear (and correct if I am wrong) that the poster expected a phone that "just works"
n900 is NOT a phone that "just works" - regardless of which side of the n900 fence you are on.
even if a community volunteer fixes these bugs promptly, this is just a bandaid - the next bug comes along that doesnt get fixed promptly will just bring the opening poster back asking "dude where is my fix!"
the clear solution here is to align user expectation with the right product, and so the solution here is for the user to sell the n900 and get another phone that meets their needs. This is the ONLY solution that will solve the underlying problem, regardless of whether it is the user's fault for not doing homework or Nokia for misleading marketing.
again i repeat, the fundamental problem is that the poster has expectations that the product cannot provide, so the ONLY solution here is to sell your n900 and get a product that DOES fufil his requirements.
IMO, the whole point here is precisely, WHOSE fault it is... and in such case, your proposed "solution" only makes people with legitimate right to claim more upset.
To put it into perspective: So you are trying to convince us all that if/when I buy a car, if my window elevator breaks (usb connector), the engine suddenly stops responding to throttle (freezes), or has erroneous, unexpected behaviours throughout the whole product (imagine a car where braking would turn on the front lights, for instance...), then the solution to my problems is NOT to demand the car producer to fix them, but to sell the car, lose my money in the process, and buy another, new one that would work well in all those BASIC functions...??? Come on....
This I-will-excuse-and-protect-Nokia-no-matter-what-shi**y-product-they-throw-at-me attitude is what is partly causing this whole community to get such half--baked products.
Now I will go f*ck myself and get me an iPhone, Galaxy S, or Motorio, you know what? They all WORK, when they don't, they have SUPPORT.
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2010-06-15
, 09:59
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Posts: 47 |
Thanked: 10 times |
Joined on Jan 2010
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#17
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Originally Posted by Frappacino
I doubt that arugment would work in the UK or many other countries. Where a product has to be fit for purpose.
hey i am not a fanboy far from it - I think Nokia should reap the consequences of its actions and get punished in the marketplace severey - which will happen when ppl do not buy their phones.
regardless of WHOs fault it was, from the opening post it was clear (and correct if I am wrong) that the poster expected a phone that "just works"
n900 is NOT a phone that "just works" - regardless of which side of the n900 fence you are on.
even if a community volunteer fixes these bugs promptly, this is just a bandaid - the next bug comes along that doesnt get fixed promptly will just bring the opening poster back asking "dude where is my fix!"
the clear solution here is to align user expectation with the right product, and so the solution here is for the user to sell the n900 and get another phone that meets their needs. This is the ONLY solution that will solve the underlying problem, regardless of whether it is the user's fault for not doing homework or Nokia for misleading marketing.
again i repeat, the fundamental problem is that the poster has expectations that the product cannot provide, so the ONLY solution here is to sell your n900 and get a product that DOES fufil his requirements.
Although the N900 is sold as a tablet computer with phone function when sold with a contract via resellers its still classified as a phone..
If its true about Tescos in the UK wholesaling them then it will be intresting if they seel them in the computer section or the phone section..
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2010-06-15
, 10:03
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Posts: 248 |
Thanked: 240 times |
Joined on Mar 2010
@ Wiltshire, UK
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#18
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Thanks for a robust defence of your original post, Fraappacino.
Your (expanded) points are valid, but probably not what someone needs to hear when they've just invested in what they believed was a top of the range' product..!
Had you been so eloquent in your first post I would not have scalded myself with hot coffee scrambling to defend what appeared to be a dismissive attack!
You are of course right that N900 does not 'just work' out-of-the-box and have correctly identified the problem Nokia have created by encouraging the 'wrong' people to buy the device.
My point was that we have to be careful how we respond as a community to help control Troll breeding.
I still maintain your original comment was not helpful. but I am heartened to see that you are clearly no fanboy.
I am sure we all are aware how values of used N900's have dropped to below the price of, say a new E72 (a phone that does 'work' on many levels) so selling is just not an option for many.
This community is the last and only recourse for disatisfied owners. If we dismiss them we'll turn them into Trolls who will block the flow of useful info and help (see Helmuth's excellent post above - Man that guy knows his bugs!)
Nokia are evidently aware of this problem - I received a text questionaire yesterday from Nokia asking if I'd recommend N900 to a friend, so maybe, just maybe the tide is turning...
Your (expanded) points are valid, but probably not what someone needs to hear when they've just invested in what they believed was a top of the range' product..!
Had you been so eloquent in your first post I would not have scalded myself with hot coffee scrambling to defend what appeared to be a dismissive attack!
You are of course right that N900 does not 'just work' out-of-the-box and have correctly identified the problem Nokia have created by encouraging the 'wrong' people to buy the device.
My point was that we have to be careful how we respond as a community to help control Troll breeding.
I still maintain your original comment was not helpful. but I am heartened to see that you are clearly no fanboy.
I am sure we all are aware how values of used N900's have dropped to below the price of, say a new E72 (a phone that does 'work' on many levels) so selling is just not an option for many.
This community is the last and only recourse for disatisfied owners. If we dismiss them we'll turn them into Trolls who will block the flow of useful info and help (see Helmuth's excellent post above - Man that guy knows his bugs!)
Nokia are evidently aware of this problem - I received a text questionaire yesterday from Nokia asking if I'd recommend N900 to a friend, so maybe, just maybe the tide is turning...
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2010-06-15
, 10:07
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Posts: 478 |
Thanked: 101 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
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#19
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The problem is that without having too great a look into what the n900 actual is, a number of people may have bought the device in error or more likely, pushed into a contract with the device by a sales person who doesn't care.
I have been locked into a two year contract with my n900, to a degree it doesn't bother me as I like the phone, I did my research and I knew what I was getting but only to a degree, I can't be expected to delve into all of the issues nokia has with their phones or more so customer services and in the end the phone will come accross as a bad choice.
Yes, the op could easily jump ship but what if he/she too is locked into a year or two's contract? Surely saying, "you should have done your homework" to a point is true but for most people out there a phone is bought with only a few minutes of use... The irony here is that this kind of person doesn't look into buying a phone they don't do loads of research they say things like, "it has a keyboard, and I saw them playing this cool bounce game on it" that is their logic behind buying the phone.
The crux of the problem is that to fix the problem that these users are facing should be a fairly simple task, It's the easy things like "why does every menu seem to behave differently, why is there no mms, why can't a type a small letter at the begining of a sentance" It's a shame these simple problems are not sorted, even a statment by Nokia suggesting a date for pr1.3 would be nice, at least to know that work is being done and that a solution is on the horizon.
I have been locked into a two year contract with my n900, to a degree it doesn't bother me as I like the phone, I did my research and I knew what I was getting but only to a degree, I can't be expected to delve into all of the issues nokia has with their phones or more so customer services and in the end the phone will come accross as a bad choice.
Yes, the op could easily jump ship but what if he/she too is locked into a year or two's contract? Surely saying, "you should have done your homework" to a point is true but for most people out there a phone is bought with only a few minutes of use... The irony here is that this kind of person doesn't look into buying a phone they don't do loads of research they say things like, "it has a keyboard, and I saw them playing this cool bounce game on it" that is their logic behind buying the phone.
The crux of the problem is that to fix the problem that these users are facing should be a fairly simple task, It's the easy things like "why does every menu seem to behave differently, why is there no mms, why can't a type a small letter at the begining of a sentance" It's a shame these simple problems are not sorted, even a statment by Nokia suggesting a date for pr1.3 would be nice, at least to know that work is being done and that a solution is on the horizon.
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2010-06-15
, 10:13
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Posts: 61 |
Thanked: 30 times |
Joined on Aug 2009
@ Madrid, Spain
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#20
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Just to remark and point it out,
Complaining for false advertising of a bug-plagued "mobile computer", is NOT trolling. It is purely and simply telling the truth, no matter how much it disturbs or irritates to real fanboys.
On the other hand, me myself am not an ordinary user, and part of my buying decission was made on opennes and freedom to tinker with my device... But NOT at the expense of quality or polish.
So Nokia, u want to offer these concepts as a plus? That's ok. But if you offer them as the only selling points, then advertise it properly and many of us will go elsewhere.
Complaining for false advertising of a bug-plagued "mobile computer", is NOT trolling. It is purely and simply telling the truth, no matter how much it disturbs or irritates to real fanboys.
On the other hand, me myself am not an ordinary user, and part of my buying decission was made on opennes and freedom to tinker with my device... But NOT at the expense of quality or polish.
So Nokia, u want to offer these concepts as a plus? That's ok. But if you offer them as the only selling points, then advertise it properly and many of us will go elsewhere.
