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tabletrat is offline tabletrat
2007-08-29 , 17:17
Posts: 481 | Thanked: 65 times | Joined on Aug 2007 @ Westcountry, UK
#11
Originally Posted by thehobbit View Post
The iphone does have a touch screen. And the biggest the iphone has is 8 gb, so it could easily compete with the iphones flash memory.
I think he was refering to the title which says iPod killer, not iPhone killer.
But obviously it refers to the iPhone, which is a nice change as I must have seen 100 different iPod killers come and go, so it would be nice to see the iPhone killer phrase start.

Having said that, I don't see how you can actually have an 'iPhone killer'. The iPod, yes, has a huge market dent, so there is something to kill, but the iPhone? must be currently 0.0001% of the market or something - not much to kill!

Still, the best thing about the iPhone is it may encourage phone developers to think about what they are doing, rather than adding more and more junk to phones.
 
ragnar is offline ragnar
2007-08-29 , 17:45
Posts: 631 | Thanked: 1,123 times | Joined on Sep 2005 @ Helsinki
#12
Originally Posted by tabletrat View Post
I have heard that before - it was the reason that orange (uk) wouldn't have one of the linux phones, they couldn't have a system that the user could get to the network stack. In the symbian system the network stack has a amanagement section that stops people having direct access to the network. The iPhone runs OSX and no effort has ever been made (in fact the opposite) to prevent the user accessing the network directly.
Allow me to be skeptical on this issue still.

There are also other phones than Symbian and Apple phones. Microsoft OS, Palm OS, both allowing 3rd party applications. Own OS:s from Asian manufacturers, Then all kinds of Linux variants. You are claiming tat the iPhone is different from all of those?

And it's not as if you _can't_ create 3rd party software for the iPhone. Hackers are doing that already, with pretty much full access to the device. If you could really "crash the network" with an iPhone mal-application, you would imagine that AT&T and Apple would be a bit more concerned that what they seem to be, since people are perfectly capable of creating those applications, with a little of effort.
 
tabletrat's Avatar
tabletrat is offline tabletrat
2007-08-29 , 18:33
Posts: 481 | Thanked: 65 times | Joined on Aug 2007 @ Westcountry, UK
#13
Originally Posted by ragnar View Post
Allow me to be skeptical on this issue still.
I would never deny someone the right to be sceptical

There are also other phones than Symbian and Apple phones. Microsoft OS, Palm OS, both allowing 3rd party applications. Own OS:s from Asian manufacturers, Then all kinds of Linux variants. You are claiming tat the iPhone is different from all of those?
Yes. The Microsoft mobile, palm and presumably other manufacturers also have a management mode to prevent unsupervised access to the phone/data stack. They are all mature phone platforms. The iPhone is very new and runs a version of OSX, which was not designed to go on a phone. It is impressive what they have done, but it is early.
It is very important when people pay for their data (and whether they do on AT&T, when they get to the rest of the world they will) that the phone doesn't allow applications unfettered access to the network.

I don't know about linux phones, I have never seen any provided by a network in the UK although obviously that doesn't meant they didn't, and in fact it seems I was wrong about orange not having linux phones:
http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS7533886035.html


As you say you can create 3rd party software for the iPhone currently but that is not with apples permissions, and there are probably no restrictions on what you can do on the network.
If you get someone to install something on one of those phones that can exploit a weekness on the iPhone and get an application installed, there would be nothing to stop it. On a nokia it would ask you if you wanted to connect.
But that is not an approved thing. And of course you can crash the network, you can crash any network if you 'get lucky'. Didn't AT&T crash their phone network once with some bad programming on a switch?

I do think there will be some access coming, even if it is just flash. I think that the platform is young, and they haven't really had time to do anything and their priority is getting it out there.
Ultimately they know there wont be any stopping it but you know how controlling apple are, they will do it on their terms. They also have to make sure that people can't access the network without permission. Maybe that is just for the carriers piece of mind, but a large part of the phone market is political rather than technical.

I am there ready to buy one as soon as there is some sort of application environment, this is if the european one gets 3G - a non 3G phone isn't much use to me at this point.
 
sherifnix is offline sherifnix
2007-08-29 , 18:38
Posts: 344 | Thanked: 26 times | Joined on Jan 2007
#14
Originally Posted by iball View Post
Hmmm...yeah, the jury's still out for me on TS-enabled S60 devices. I'd have to do some serious hands-on, especially with the reports of iPhone touchscreens going wonky with dead strips and having to be turned in for repair/replacement.
Seriously, my entire department has iphones (8 people) and there were no bad touchscreens.

I've never heard any reports on these "dead strips" and that would be ALLLLLLLLLLLL over the news if that was the case. I hate to be the defender of iPhone, but you're pulling an odd argument against touch screens. Nokia fixed their N800 screen problems last i checked?
 
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Texrat is offline Texrat
2007-08-29 , 18:48
Posts: 11,700 | Thanked: 10,045 times | Joined on Jun 2006 @ North Texas, USA
#15
Originally Posted by rok View Post
Engadget Video:
http://www.engadget.com/2007/08/29/n...-no-seriously/

The screen has similar dimensions compared to my beloved N800.

Texrat, it's your turn!
I think some people are pessimistic about a release date.
 
iball's Avatar
iball is offline iball
2007-08-29 , 18:57
Posts: 729 | Thanked: 19 times | Joined on Mar 2007
#16
Originally Posted by sherifnix View Post
Seriously, my entire department has iphones (8 people) and there were no bad touchscreens.

I've never heard any reports on these "dead strips" and that would be ALLLLLLLLLLLL over the news if that was the case. I hate to be the defender of iPhone, but you're pulling an odd argument against touch screens. Nokia fixed their N800 screen problems last i checked?
Did the internet "break"? Is Google offline?
Google is your friend.
 
Rebski is offline Rebski
2007-08-29 , 19:32
Posts: 874 | Thanked: 316 times | Joined on Jun 2007 @ London UK
#17
Will it upset you all to be told that it is vaporware?

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/smartphon...sso-294730.php

"This demo is strictly for the UI, not the device. The hardware is not even real. The LCD's images are overlayed on the hardware so we're not even talking working proto"
 
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Karel Jansens is offline Karel Jansens
2007-08-29 , 19:40
Posts: 3,220 | Thanked: 326 times | Joined on Oct 2005 @ "Almost there!" (Monte Christo, Count of)
#18
All I've seen is a shady video of a device that appears to have a tilt sensor and a finger-friendly UI (if it is a UI, and not just the one application that mimicks the iPhone (<spit!>), of course).

I for one don't think that the iPhone's (<spit!>) UI is God's gift to humanity: It's finger-only, has only one input method, doesn't manage to implement all those shiny UI gimmicks in every application and is severely limited as a computing platform. So Nokia could do a whole lot better than try to imitate the iPhone (<spit!>).

If this thing is Nokia's "answer" to the iPhone (<spit!>) -- assuming for the moment that there was a question to begin with -- than it is this reporter's opinion that they're seriously scr*wed.
 
ragnar is offline ragnar
2007-08-29 , 19:53
Posts: 631 | Thanked: 1,123 times | Joined on Sep 2005 @ Helsinki
#19
Originally Posted by Rebski View Post
Will it upset you all to be told that it is vaporware?

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/smartphon...sso-294730.php
"This demo is strictly for the UI, not the device. The hardware is not even real. The LCD's images are overlayed on the hardware so we're not even talking working proto"
It kinds of depends on your definition of vaporware. As it said in the link, it is an UI demo for future S60 SW, supporting also touch screen devices. What the hardware there in that video is imho rather irrelevant.

Whereas iPhone is the combination of the device+the SW, S60, as you know, is the SW platform. It can run on any number of devices, so if the ... black blob device in the video isn't real, i frankly don't really see the relevance to the issue. It wasn't a demo of the HW, it was a demo of the SW.

HW:s that are capable of running touch screen UI's exist. It wouldn't be tied to any one particular HW form factor. Google "S60 touch".
 
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barry99705 is offline barry99705
2007-08-29 , 20:48
Posts: 641 | Thanked: 27 times | Joined on Apr 2007
#20
Originally Posted by ragnar View Post
It kinds of depends on your definition of vaporware. As it said in the link, it is an UI demo for future S60 SW, supporting also touch screen devices. What the hardware there in that video is imho rather irrelevant.

Whereas iPhone is the combination of the device+the SW, S60, as you know, is the SW platform. It can run on any number of devices, so if the ... black blob device in the video isn't real, i frankly don't really see the relevance to the issue. It wasn't a demo of the HW, it was a demo of the SW.

HW:s that are capable of running touch screen UI's exist. It wouldn't be tied to any one particular HW form factor. Google "S60 touch".

I know 5 or 6 6th graders that can build a "UI demo" in flash that looks ten times better than that piece of crap or the iPhone. When they show a real chunk of hardware with at least a demo of the UI running, then I'll maybe get excited.
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