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| The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to geneven For This Useful Post: | ||
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2012-04-12
, 20:29
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@ Mountain View (CA, USA)
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#192
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If that is a concern I can certainly keep myself to a strict Nokia/them role. I just got too used to the 'everybody is a community member' mood of MeeGo and Qt Project.
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2012-04-12
, 20:35
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#193
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You mentioned earlier in this thread that you were looking at sourcing devices.
Is that a possibility or should I look deeper into my Nokia Developer's account for something? I guess I'm asking (publicly) because there's a huge chance that I will have to update a project from Android over to other mobile OS's and I have to do mobile OS eval sorta soon.
Just thought I'd bring that back up.
Is that a possibility or should I look deeper into my Nokia Developer's account for something? I guess I'm asking (publicly) because there's a huge chance that I will have to update a project from Android over to other mobile OS's and I have to do mobile OS eval sorta soon.
Just thought I'd bring that back up.
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2012-04-12
, 20:51
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Posts: 2,535 |
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Joined on Mar 2008
@ UK
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#194
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Originally Posted by qgil
DNFTT. On the one hand we have people complaining that Nokia hasn't been involved enough (in terms of being involved, being aware, having a word with Nemein if/when necessary); and now there's complaint that Nokia's community guy is too involved in shaping the direction of the community.
If that is a concern I can certainly keep myself to a strict Nokia/them role. I just got too used to the 'everybody is a community member' mood of MeeGo and Qt Project.
Since no-one else seems to be coming up with a coherent view of what the community should be, I don't see why Quim - someone who's put a lot of effort in to this community - shouldn't share his view. Especially when that view is a historical perspective - something too easily lost in the constant "them" and "us" whining from some people in the "community".
It's hardly as if he was saying "the council cannot, and must not, do that or we'll pull the funding". FFS.
EDIT: "No-one coming up with a coherent view" is unfair. A few posts above ivgalvez is aligned with common sense and my own view (I think); timoph is trying to get things in the open; Estel's enthusiastic (even if I don't completely agree). However, no-one has yet laid out "this is what the community should be; this is what we should do to get there". Talk about a self-governing legal entity in that regard seems totally premature.
__________________
Andrew Flegg -- mailto:andrew@bleb.org | http://www.bleb.org
Andrew Flegg -- mailto:andrew@bleb.org | http://www.bleb.org
Last edited by Jaffa; 2012-04-12 at 20:58. Reason: PS
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2012-04-12
, 20:59
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Posts: 7,075 |
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@ Moon! It's not the East or the West side... it's the Dark Side
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#195
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Nokia is rude as a company and due to that suffers the anger and limited support from its customers.
I hope all nokia employees here joining the discussions as a community member rather than nokia employees.
The greatest assets from nokia to the community is the hidden work/help from nokia employees. Now, when can I vote, where can I vote.
CHUCK
I hope all nokia employees here joining the discussions as a community member rather than nokia employees.
The greatest assets from nokia to the community is the hidden work/help from nokia employees. Now, when can I vote, where can I vote.
CHUCK
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2012-04-12
, 20:59
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Posts: 2,535 |
Thanked: 6,681 times |
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@ UK
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#196
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Originally Posted by geneven
Can I claim to be Benjamin Franklin, or George Washington or some other "founding father" then? I ain't King George, but I think Quim's historical perspective is spot on.
This thread is funny, when we have Nokia explaining what the Council means, rather like having King George explain the Consitution. This is one reason I don't want to be part of the process. Historically, though, Councils have evolved beyond what the King had in mind.
__________________
Andrew Flegg -- mailto:andrew@bleb.org | http://www.bleb.org
Andrew Flegg -- mailto:andrew@bleb.org | http://www.bleb.org
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2012-04-12
, 21:51
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#197
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+ on right for everyone to express opinions as a member - of course, unless explicitly asked to provide organization's point of view, but it's common sense, so I think everyone understands.
BTW, I'm huge fan of recent ideas about ways to "bring other resources home" - it's more and more resembling peaceful co-existence and collaboration, loosing smell of "hostile takeover" with every new day/discussion page
Just simple example - few months ago, marias stated (during Council meeting), that appsformeego will be merged with Maemo, that it's decided already, and no one need to ask Maemo Community/Council what we think about it (last sentence was stated more politely, yet with exact same meaning). Now, Community OBS is being created (with important part of Nokia support, I must add), representatives of Communities discuss it and decide on their own, how it should look...
That's what I call positive change. I must say, that I'm also optimistic.
/Estel
Last edited by Estel; 2012-04-12 at 21:55.
BTW, I'm huge fan of recent ideas about ways to "bring other resources home" - it's more and more resembling peaceful co-existence and collaboration, loosing smell of "hostile takeover" with every new day/discussion page
Just simple example - few months ago, marias stated (during Council meeting), that appsformeego will be merged with Maemo, that it's decided already, and no one need to ask Maemo Community/Council what we think about it (last sentence was stated more politely, yet with exact same meaning). Now, Community OBS is being created (with important part of Nokia support, I must add), representatives of Communities discuss it and decide on their own, how it should look...
That's what I call positive change. I must say, that I'm also optimistic.
/Estel
__________________
N900's aluminum backcover / body replacement
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N900's HDMI-Out
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Camera cover MOD
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Measure battery's real capacity on-device
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TrueCrypt 7.1 | ereswap | bnf
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Hardware's mods research is costly. To support my work, please consider donating. Thank You!
N900's aluminum backcover / body replacement
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N900's HDMI-Out
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Camera cover MOD
-
Measure battery's real capacity on-device
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TrueCrypt 7.1 | ereswap | bnf
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Hardware's mods research is costly. To support my work, please consider donating. Thank You!
Last edited by Estel; 2012-04-12 at 21:55.
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2012-04-12
, 21:58
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@ Mountain View (CA, USA)
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#198
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Originally Posted by gerbick
Yes, it's just that I don't feel like discussing your case (or anybody's specific case). What we should discuss is the plan for seeding devices.
You mentioned earlier in this thread that you were looking at sourcing devices.
Starting points that come to mind:
- "I have this app and I want to port / develop it and publish it at apps.formeego.org" (or successor, and/or Nokia Store).
- "I have this app / this idea and I want to run it in Qt 5 on the N9."
And then a process to decide who and why.
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2012-04-12
, 23:54
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@ Springfield, MA, USA
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#199
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Originally Posted by qgil
The difference is to put our time and energies in constructive discussions and into getting things done. There are many other topics apart from the basically exhausted topic of opening components, with a much higher impact in maemo.org users and developers.
For instance, what to do with apps.formeego.org and what would be ideal relationship you would like maemo.org to have with other immediate neighbors like Mer, Qt Project, Nokia Developer...
Originally Posted by qgil
So, again, the point is to change the discussion away from open-source and whenever it is brought up make sure to dismiss it off into a flurry of discussions that basically STILL boil down to the script as I read them.. ironically, and very meta, proving it out as an accurate representation. It also still doesn't answer the question of whether people in the council will have the ability to represent the users and developers in that context with any kind of power to enable the consumer and community to truly own and future-proof these devices past and present (I suppose I can omit future). So yeah--once again, I want to know what a council member can do. From the Nokia side: Maybe the honest answer here is 'nothing' and at least stop dancing around pretending there is a route to openness? From the nominations: Maybe the honest answer is 'shake my fist futilty' and at least admit there's no point and no future despite existing hardware that could be more updated/secure and have an extended life beyond the current kernel?
... Or other projects out there like developing and running Qt 5 apps with the N9.
Even the role of N9 users and developers here seems to need still some agreement, it seems.
Originally Posted by Jaffa
I agree--I want him here as one of 'us' but the fact that he's also one of 'them' cannot be forgotten. Despite my increasingly stark, frank and probably gruff tone over the years, I can appreciate that he at least answers back and you cannot imagine how much vocal and worse I think I would have been if he hadn't been around to answer some of my responses.
Can I claim to be Benjamin Franklin, or George Washington or some other "founding father" then? I ain't King George, but I think Quim's historical perspective is spot on.
Feedback is always appreciated--even if I don't appreciate the feedback. Grok?
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Nokia's slogan shouldn't be the pedo-palmgrabbing image with the slogan, "Connecting People"... It should be one hand open pleadingly with another hand giving the middle finger and the more apt slogan, "Potential Unrealized." --DR
Nokia's slogan shouldn't be the pedo-palmgrabbing image with the slogan, "Connecting People"... It should be one hand open pleadingly with another hand giving the middle finger and the more apt slogan, "Potential Unrealized." --DR
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2012-04-13
, 02:49
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#200
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Originally Posted by qgil
simple question: will there be a Qt 5 port for the N900 / Maemo - Fremantle?
Yes, it's just that I don't feel like discussing your case (or anybody's specific case). What we should discuss is the plan for seeding devices.
Starting points that come to mind:
- "I have this app and I want to port / develop it and publish it at apps.formeego.org" (or successor, and/or Nokia Store).
- "I have this app / this idea and I want to run it in Qt 5 on the N9."
Originally Posted by qgil
you (whoever "I" is...)?
And then a process to decide who and why.
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information is a necessary though no sufficient condition to rationality...
information is a necessary though no sufficient condition to rationality...
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