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Lumiaman	2012-07-21 , 22:42
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The US market is very important. Its the most competitive market and there is no room for error and crappy phones. Nokia shunned the US because it was complacent to sell inferior phones elsewhere . World has become a global community and you people everywhere demand the best product. Nokia cant sell suboptimal devices anymore. If they gather significant share in the US , they will do elsewhere too. That is why the US market is so important .

Lumiaman	2012-07-21 , 22:44
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We have a lot of symbian apologists here.

Lumiaman	2012-07-21 , 22:48
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Nothing outsells iphone. IPhone is a single phone while Android powers many. I was amazed to see so many iPhones in Europe. In germany they dot even think Nokia exists anymore.

the spelling mistakes are due to inferior N9 auto correction .

gerbick	2012-07-22 , 01:43
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Originally Posted by switch-hitter

I certainly don't think it's something NOKIA could recreate.

They have a cult following that's based on their durability. But beyond that, Nokia went from one of the best built devices to the cheap devices that you get for free subsidies and flip phones in the North American market.

Quite sad.

specc	2012-07-22 , 01:52
Posts: 322 \| Thanked: 218 times \| Joined on Feb 2012	#1995

Originally Posted by gerbick

The irony that WP7 is sitting at 2% yet users like my mother are the 99% means there is a disconnect somewhere.

And that disconnect is what gives Nokia such a low stock price and such low sales.

For Christ sake Gerbick. You have been around for some time, and you know just as well as I that even the best does not necessarily equal success just like that. If it would, we would not all be using MS Windows on our PCs. We would not have a "PC" we would have a Amiga running Amiga OS ver 3x.x.

Luckily it's a different time now with space for much more variety on our mobile devices.

specc	2012-07-22 , 02:04
Posts: 322 \| Thanked: 218 times \| Joined on Feb 2012	#1996

Originally Posted by gerbick

Link me. I think that's what I'm saying and you're not getting.

Regardless. Nokia is at the mercy of Microsoft at this moment. Microsoft announced the WP8 upgrade path (read: none) and the Lumia sales dipped, dropped, and now the price is cut in half (at least in the US) on contract and they're losing even more money.

And you people that find this a "good thing" possess a vantage point that I'd never consider healthy for Nokia. They can't give away the Lumia 900 right now. Even non-savvy users know about the lack of upgrades.

I have already linked it, look it up yourself. Nobody is saying it's a good thing WP7.x devices cannot be upgraded to WP8. But it's not the utter disaster some of you want it to be. It's not going to kill Nokia and WP8.

specc	2012-07-22 , 02:45
Posts: 322 \| Thanked: 218 times \| Joined on Feb 2012	#1997

Originally Posted by Lumiaman

We have a lot of symbian apologists here.

Careful now Lumiaman

Pre 2007/2008 Symbian on a Nokia was "the thing". Even a Nokia without Symbian was "the thing". But no matter how good Nokia+Symbian was, it was never a mass marked product, and was not marketed as a mass market product, at least not before 2007. After 2007 it became a mass market product, but it wasn't a good enough mass market product, it had no chance against Android and iPhone. As an enthusiast toy though, Symbian devices still are top of the line with the 808.

Neither the iPhone nor WP are enthusiast devices. My Lumia 800 is the best everyday phone I have had, but anything more than that and it fails, falls through completely. Atm I can live with that, and I hope (and believe) WP8 becomes something more. The N9 also falls through IMO as a enthusiast device, it's too limited HW vise and the OS is also too restricted. It has nothing of the sheer, brute "Old school Nokia smartphone" like for instance the N8 or in particular the 808. The N900 was much better in that respect than the N9. The N9 doesn't make it as an enthusiast device or as a mass market device. It had potential as a mass market device though, but grandmothers and multitasking phones are two incompatible devices, lots of geek stuff would have to be thrown away for that to happen.

gerbick	2012-07-22 , 03:11
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Originally Posted by specc

For Christ sake Gerbick. You have been around for some time, and you know just as well as I that even the best does not necessarily equal success just like that.

Thus a dilemma in your reasoning. If you think WP7 is the best, it will not exactly be a success. How does that help Nokia exactly?

Let's take a look at their stock prices......

If it would, we would not all be using MS Windows on our PCs. We would not have a "PC" we would have a Amiga running Amiga OS ver 3x.x.

Amiga is the one you run behind? Meh. BeOS was better since it had 64-bit journaling and better media.

Luckily it's a different time now with space for much more variety on our mobile devices.

Meh. Mediocrity still reigns supreme.

specc	2012-07-22 , 03:14
Posts: 322 \| Thanked: 218 times \| Joined on Feb 2012	#1999

I didn't say WP7 was the best. What I said was even the best is no guaranty for success. At the time I rated Amiga better than the PC. BeOS was also good, but it was only an OS, and it never really made it to mainstream.

Look. I believe Nokia will make it because WP8 will make it. WP8 will make it because huge forces are behind it, pushing it from more than one direction, and because the UI is easy and forgiveable to use, ie grandma proof. Now, if WP8 also include some more functionality, both HW and software, more of what I'm used to with Symbian/Maemo/Android, then there is no objective reason to not accept it as a good state of the art OS. Not for anyone. The only reasons for not liking it will be of the philosophical and/or emotional kind.

But, as with the Amiga, you never now. I would be very surprised though if 1. WP8 does not gain a decent market share. 2 Nokia does not again become a profitable company.

Last edited by specc; 2012-07-22 at 03:34.

cheve	2012-07-22 , 03:25
Posts: 362 \| Thanked: 143 times \| Joined on Mar 2008	#2000

Originally Posted by specc

3 year contract!!! Three years!!! What bozo would do that, regardless of phone? Here I can get the SGS3 , iPhone 4s, Lumia 900 Whatever I want for $0.2 (20 cents) on 1 (one) year contract.

Suckers!!!

you have missed the point. at least for where i live, big national chains all offer 'deal' like that - ie. you pay some $$ up front and then tie to some 2 or 3 yr contract. it may sound a rip off to you, but these are the options the average joe/jane can have. the point i am making is this: for these national chains to offer the Lumia 900 with such terms within such a short time after official release of Lumia 900, it really means that this phone is not selling well at all - bad news for Nokia.

Here are other reference points(all with 3yr contract term) for you - SGS3 ( $129), SGS2 ( $0), iphone 4 ($99, 32GB, this is not 4s), the iphone 4s($160 for 16GB; $270 for 32GB), blackberry bold ($75). As a re-cap, nokia Lumia 900 ( $0, plus $100 gift card). These asking prices reflect the highest $$$ that the average public are willing to pay. it does not look good for Lumia 900, specifically, at about 1 month ago, they were asking for $50 or so.

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Active Topics

The N900 is now 15 years old! (8)

Sailfish OS for the Motorola Moto G7 Power (XT1955-5) - (ocean) (4)