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2009-01-11
, 20:54
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Posts: 631 |
Thanked: 1,123 times |
Joined on Sep 2005
@ Helsinki
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#212
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Originally Posted by Texrat
Well, yes, if a hardware solution balances this, i.e. takes away a particular point on the touch screen that the users would press all the them then I agree. the iPhone HW home key does that, supposing that the alternative would to have the Home button on-screen, on a fixed position.
ragnar, you completely missed my point, and I apologize if that was my fault. However, I think you may be so predisposed toward arguing against the d-pad (et al) and that is affecting your interpretation.
Anyway, I mean to say that inclusion of an auxiliary hardware input device can reduce the stress on the touchscreen. Case in point: one of mine is wearing out in a very specific area. That is due mainly to my mode of use. Eventually I expect that region to be less responsive (and I suspect it is already getting there) whereas the remainder of the screen will continue to be useful. Using a hardware solution could balance my usage to the point that wear-and-tear would be more evenly distributed across the touchscreen.
I cannot emphasize the highlighted portion enough. THAT will turn out to be the hallmark of best practice touchscreen UI design.
Then again, of getting back to the key we were discussing: I don't see the d-pad doing this, though. Inputs that the d-pad would replace fall rather evenly on the screen.
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2009-01-11
, 20:58
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Posts: 3,790 |
Thanked: 5,718 times |
Joined on Mar 2006
@ Vienna, Austria
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#213
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Originally Posted by allnameswereout
Well, this only shows that people are different. I have an S60 phone and find using its UI easier (and, above all, more efficient) than that on my N800 when I'm actually walking/riding the bus/.... Its's just press key, keypad up/down, keypad center. Done with the thumb while I hold the device in my hand. It's the holy grail of interface design for a mobile device.
Lately, I've been using S60Browser with d-pad. I can't express how much I miss being able to touch and scroll around on the screen (and the screen is a little bit too small, too).
Originally Posted by allnameswereout
I never quite understood what liqbase is supposed to do (learning now it's an e-book reader is interesting - maybe I should re-install it), let alone how to use it. So can't say much here. (Maybe except that "at least the device is usable without a d-pad" doesn't seem a very strong point against having a d-pad.)
The success of an application such as Liqbase for e-book reading is also telling that at least the device is usable without a d-pad
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2009-01-11
, 21:00
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Posts: 5,335 |
Thanked: 8,187 times |
Joined on Mar 2007
@ Pennsylvania, USA
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#214
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Originally Posted by Texrat
My post was just a bit facetious. I could put forth my own opinions on the topic at hand, but I might as well detail a case for why my favorite color is superior to all others.
Although I am reluctant myself to limit discussion that way...
Pot shots at the proud folks who won't touch an N810 for fear of contracting inferior D-pad location cooties though?. That's good, clean fun.
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maemo.org profile
Last edited by sjgadsby; 2009-01-12 at 01:52. Reason: The N810's hardware keyboard cannot stop my power of typo.
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2009-01-11
, 21:01
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Posts: 1,635 |
Thanked: 1,816 times |
Joined on Apr 2008
@ Manchester, England
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#215
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benny, liqbase is just me learning and trying out a lot of ideas and principles I've thought about for a while.
Its evolving again and being cleaned up and has been split into specific apps (one of which is a book reader).
Its evolving again and being cleaned up and has been split into specific apps (one of which is a book reader).
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liqbase sketching the future.
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liqbase sketching the future.
like what i say? hit the Thanks, thanks!
twitter.com/lcuk
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2009-01-11
, 21:34
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Posts: 610 |
Thanked: 391 times |
Joined on Feb 2006
@ DC, USA
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#216
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Originally Posted by ragnar
Thus allowing the screen to last longer. Good point!
I don't see the d-pad doing this, though. Inputs that the d-pad would replace fall rather evenly on the screen.
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2009-01-11
, 21:35
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Posts: 2,427 |
Thanked: 2,986 times |
Joined on Dec 2007
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#217
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Originally Posted by sjgadsby
Sounds good, except for the chronological refresh fallacy. When a company refreshes hardware, it's generally perceived that all changes are improvements. I'm assuming, of course, that the n810 was an n800 refresh. Thus, exclusive n800 users would be unaffected and hybrid n8x0 users would be tainted. Exclusive n810 users wouldn't count. So, no, any n800 owners would be aloud to participate in a d-pad discussion, but more weight would be given to exclusive n800 owner comments.
Excellent. Let's limit participation in this discussion to those who can speak with the experience that comes from owning both an N810 and an earlier Internet Tablet model.
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N9: Go white or go home
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2009-01-11
, 21:44
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Posts: 3,397 |
Thanked: 1,212 times |
Joined on Jul 2008
@ Netherlands
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#218
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Originally Posted by benny1967
My statement refers to browing with S60Browser compared to MicroB. Both the stock browsers of the devices. My statement is not about S60 with touch screen interface, nor about S60 in general. I love using the d-pad through my messages on S60, and I love using GNU Screen. But, there are good, practical alternatives.
Well, this only shows that people are different. I have an S60 phone and find using its UI easier
I tend to lean that a designer has to pick either one. Go for non-touch, with a keypad and keys and with a tree in which you can navigate fast. Or, something more visual and aesthetic which makes use of finger-based touch screen. A stylus toch-based screen design is a dead path IMNSHO.
I am not saying is d-pad is required, or useless. I am saying that, if properly designed (and with existing references) it is possible to not have one and still have a different yet good (potentially better) experience. Is this easy to achieve? No. Is it possible? Yes, since others have archieved this as well.
(and, above all, more efficient) than that on my N800 when I'm actually walking/riding the bus/.... Its's just press key, keypad up/down, keypad center. Done with the thumb while I hold the device in my hand.
It's the holy grail of interface design for a mobile device.
I never quite understood what liqbase is supposed to do (learning now it's an e-book reader is interesting - maybe I should re-install it)
If you want to experience smooth scrolling on your N8x0 device, try Liqbase as e-book reader. There are even demos which show this.
This experience is very much different than the robotic d-pad which isn't smooth. Smooth is harmonic/peaceful, like round. It also allows one to read with no interaction because of the speed of the smooth scrolling.
Fennec also demos this, and Clutter will allow it even easier...
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Goosfraba! All text written by allnameswereout is public domain unless stated otherwise. Thank you for sharing your output!
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2009-01-11
, 21:52
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Posts: 2,427 |
Thanked: 2,986 times |
Joined on Dec 2007
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#219
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Originally Posted by sjgadsby
And let the fun continue. What if the n810 came out first? I can just imagine what the n800 owners would say to the n810 owners, "Wudda ya mean, 'Where's the keyboard?' It's inside the screen, silly."
My post was just a bit facetious. I could put forth my own opinions on the topic at hand, but I might as well detail a case for why my favorite color is superior to all others.
Pot shots as the proud folks who won't touch an N810 for fear of contracting inferior D-pad location cooties though?. That's good, clean fun.
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2009-01-11
, 22:10
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Posts: 1,635 |
Thanked: 1,816 times |
Joined on Apr 2008
@ Manchester, England
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#220
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Originally Posted by allnameswereout
liqbase works with the dpad as well
This experience is very much different than the robotic d-pad which isn't smooth. Smooth is harmonic/peaceful, like round. It also allows one to read with no interaction because of the speed of the smooth scrolling.
and its personally what i use more for actual reading.
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liqbase sketching the future.
like what i say? hit the Thanks, thanks!
twitter.com/lcuk
liqbase sketching the future.
like what i say? hit the Thanks, thanks!
twitter.com/lcuk
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Of what the device currently is? If you have a d-pad in the device and ask users if they use it, yes some will use it. If you have an ice cube maker in a refrigerator and you ask the users for use cases or use patterns, yes some people will use it.
But so what? People want faster horses.
You want faster horses. The improved N800 would exactly the faster horse, and you've talked about that several times. (Now, there's nothing wrong with wanting them, but I'm sure you know what the saying implies.)
A more meaningful test is to give two devices to users, let's take one with a d-pad and one without a d-pad and designed for touch, and then do comparative analysis on the strengths and weaknesses of these alternatives and the things that the users prefer in them.