Let's talk Nokia stock. Really. - Page 236 - maemo.org

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gerbick	2013-11-30 , 23:02
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Originally Posted by daperl

Kind of the definition of a fart app.

One puppy.

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	qwazix	2013-12-01 , 00:11
	Moderator \| Posts: 2,622 \| Thanked: 5,447 times \| Joined on Jan 2010	#2352

Originally Posted by gerbick

What's being ignored though, the lack of quality control on the Qt apps that have come out. Some of them just plain should have never come out. Shoddy UI, lack of error capturing, severe lack of understanding on how to manage memory leaks... I get and love the Qt framework, it's easy and accessible to a lot of people.

But not all people that can code should code apps. And even more should never attempt UI/UX. It's deplorable and unusable in too many cases.

Not taking up for any mobile OS and/or development workflow here. But in all instances, I can point to some shitty half-baked apps.

And if any of you bring up fart apps, I'll murder a puppy on pay-per-view. That's not what I am talking about.

I don't think that making the actual process of creating helloWorld and submitting it to the store tedious is a sane way of keeping people who shouldn't code away though. And not that ObjC is much better in memory management. Java at least has a gc.

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gerbick	2013-12-01 , 03:55
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Originally Posted by qwazix

I don't think that making the actual process of creating helloWorld and submitting it to the store tedious is a sane way of keeping people who shouldn't code away though. And not that ObjC is much better in memory management. Java at least has a gc.

There's too many "Hello World" apps and not enough thought out apps out there. Too many "me too" apps that do the same thing and some things need to be filtered.

Sorry, I get the gist of what you're saying; however I have to point out that each and every ecosystem (shudder) has crap apps that really makes me woefully sick whenever I come across them.

Tedious or not, if it's for a client, you get paid for it. If it's for fun, then it's up to you if it's worth it. If it's your living, then you're used to it. And if you want to be taken serious, create an app that's as functional to many more people than just yourself or your limited scope would allow.

That's what is missing in a lot of these crap apps on MeeGo, Maemo, WP, Android and iOS. I hope to goodness (or the equally opposite evil) that crap apps don't find their way onto Jolla.

Study the UI, make it close to as native as the other apps, don't force your thought patterns on users and don't try to re-invent the wheel. Make good apps that look great, are useful and work great. And learn how to take criticism (good and bad and useless) as an app writer.

Meh, I'm not here to discuss what's good and bad to be honest. The tedious processes that Apple have in place annoy the ever-living **** out of me too. But they also have a detailed QA process that I admire and wish were in place for Android and WP. I shudder to think what's in store - I'll probably install just as few apps on a Jolla phone as I did on my N9.

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	qwazix	2013-12-01 , 23:21
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Then comes the question if you want a crap app or no app at all. The maemo way of things was cool IMO. You can have extras (ok I know the community QA never worked very well, but it would if maemo lived on - see debian) if you want the highest quality apps, and you could delve into devel if you absolutely need something and you could live with a bug or two, or bad interface.

I for one I am extremely happy we have xchat and gnumeric, even if they aren't totally native and need a stylus, because they are fully functional. Other apps might be finger friendly and pretty, but seeing "find&replace" making headlines as a new feature of Google Drive for android in 2013 is just sad.

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gerbick	2013-12-02 , 00:27
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Originally Posted by qwazix

Then comes the question if you want a crap app or no app at all.

I'd sometimes choose no app at all. Especially when the community kowtows to the developer that resists any assistance because his logic, therefore UI/UX is also "perfect". It happens and I hate it when it does.

The maemo way of things was cool IMO.

Agree. But there were some **** apps that could have been made 100% better if only folks were willing to work alongside others. Less ego, more cooperation. Don't ask for specifics, I'll give none. I just know it happened/existed and it really bothered me.

You can have extras (ok I know the community QA never worked very well, but it would if maemo lived on - see debian) if you want the highest quality apps, and you could delve into devel if you absolutely need something and you could live with a bug or two, or bad interface.

Shoddy control and quality assurance, shoddy apps - why live with that imperfect system when honestly it's merely ego that's in the way of progress. Not saying that the other way (walled garden) is better - that's ego that's controlling the system. Meritocracy sans ego is the way.

Some apps will have limited UI, that's fine. But having no way for proper QA/QC to limit some of the utter crap; that's my problem as well.

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	qwazix	2013-12-04 , 18:01
	Moderator \| Posts: 2,622 \| Thanked: 5,447 times \| Joined on Jan 2010	#2356

May I play the devil's advocate? :P

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Design_by_committee

Seriously though, it's impossible to incorporate everybody's opinion, especially since everyone is a self-proclaimed expert on user interface, and very hard to filter what is best and still keep consistency. Thus I understand those developers who shut all input off.

User facing decisions on a project worked by a team (or procured by a customer) require more than just good taste and usability understanding. It needs social skills and a way to explain what's on your mind with clear words and arguments. And that's not something you can always do. Sometimes I feel like a painter who is being asked why is that brushstroke there.

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	volt	2014-01-06 , 14:59
	Posts: 1,309 \| Thanked: 1,187 times \| Joined on Nov 2008	#2357

*snicker*

You know, I look at the NOK long term stock price, and I can't help but to read the graph with a little bit of humor.

When Elop left Nokia, the stock price went from liek $2 to $8. Clearly that's because a phone giant with no phones to sell is four times better than one where Elop is in charge.

Edit: Well, at least it doubled. The two dollar low was honestly a year back before that.

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Last edited by volt; 2014-01-06 at 15:11.

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	danramos	2016-05-18 , 23:23
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Originally Posted by volt

*snicker*

You know, I look at the NOK long term stock price, and I can't help but to read the graph with a little bit of humor.

When Elop left Nokia, the stock price went from liek $2 to $8. Clearly that's because a phone giant with no phones to sell is four times better than one where Elop is in charge.

Edit: Well, at least it doubled. The two dollar low was honestly a year back before that.

How's that stock looking these days? I hear Microsoft is selling the last remnants of what it bought from Nokia. Well, there goes the final remnants of Nokia's old phone business after Stephen Elop performed an expert job of driving that company into the ground for Microsoft (his old employer) to buy it up cheap, only to eventually figure out he did far too good a job of devaluing it right into the ground. I dub this the final act of what I like to call the "Elop Flop."

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gerbick	2016-05-24 , 20:51
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Originally Posted by danramos

How's that stock looking these days? I hear Microsoft is selling the last remnants of what it bought from Nokia. Well, there goes the final remnants of Nokia's old phone business after Stephen Elop performed an expert job of driving that company into the ground for Microsoft (his old employer) to buy it up cheap, only to eventually figure out he did far too good a job of devaluing it right into the ground. I dub this the final act of what I like to call the "Elop Flop."

$NOK is 5.36 right now. And let's be honest, the feature phone business was not a good revenue for income for Microsoft - who's stock has been jumping by leaps and bounds as of late.

Elop did what Ballmer wanted; not what Nadella needs for his future view of Microsoft.

And with a global presence of less than 1%, they've now become as forgotten as BlackBerry. Microsoft has already written off $7.2 Billion around the Nokia purchase.

It just hit me... holy crap, a danramos sighting...