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wmarone is offline wmarone
2010-07-20 , 05:26
Posts: 1,746 | Thanked: 2,100 times | Joined on Sep 2009
#231
Originally Posted by gerbick View Post
Will the masses?
Well, if Nokia can deliver an experience that equals or surpasses Android, then it's likely. If even one other handset vendor picks up on it, then who knows.

I don't see it as much as forward thinking as much as a natural progression given how badly Maemo was handled when it should have been handled differently and better. Nokia dragged it down.
True. But I was speaking of that as an advantage, possibly one that draws in other handset vendors.

And that's why I dislike Nokia's lust for newer, faster hardware constantly.
That's just the way of the industry. We went from ARMv6 to ARMv7 all over in less than a year.

Locked down kernel? Or the whole eFuse thing? I thought all OMAP3 processors (SOC) came with that? If so... it's in the N900 too. Just not used.
Locked down kernel. If anything using eFuse to disable the phone is simply a sad use of what appears to be an otherwise interesting technology.

I just don't see how MeeGo will attract folks. Samsung went that route because of Bada not being ready yet.
Bada would simply have further segmented the market, and it's not ideal for a high end handset. It'll be competing with S60 almost exclusively.

Motorola went that route because... well, they were basically dead in the water. LG is going that way because they really don't have an OS. So what am I missing? I don't see who would want MeeGo outside of Nokia and LG on a handset.
Anyone who wants an OS that is backed by a neutral party. On top of that, internally developing any OS is expensive and puts you way beyond your scope.
 
BatPenguin is offline BatPenguin
2010-07-20 , 07:04
Posts: 177 | Thanked: 128 times | Joined on Jan 2008 @ Espoo, Finland
#232
Originally Posted by wmarone View Post
Anyone who wants an OS that is backed by a neutral party. On top of that, internally developing any OS is expensive and puts you way beyond your scope.
I just don't see how anybody can really claim that Meego is backed by a "neutral party". It's backed by Nokia and Intel, what is so neutral about that? Meego is Nokia and Intel's baby, Android is Google's. Yes, yes, Linux Foundation this and that -- is the Linux foundation employing the developers any more than the Open Handset Allience is for Android? Imagining Meego as some champion of freedom is just silly nonsense. It's all about the companies behind the associations, those who employ the developers. Maybe you prefer Nokia to Google but it's hardly "neutral".

Also, OPK is apparently finally on his way out of Nokia (WSJ reported, just saw the news on Finnish sites, google yourself), and Nokia has been interviewing at least some American CEOs for the job. If they pick an American for the job and decide to concentrate on the US market, which that would seem to imply, it's not too far-fetched to see Android phones from Nokia sometime pretty soon or other very large re-arrangements, maybe a Windows phone with Microsoft. Just stick the Ovi stuff on Android/Windows and roll with it while desperately trying to build up Symbian4/Meego, if they decide to keep both. A new CEO simply cannot avoid making big changes. Since S60 is already on its way down to featurephones it doesn't really leave a lot of options for the short-term. Meego's not ready for phones and even if they manage to push out another beta device before the end of the year, it probably won't really be ready for challenging the competition much sooner than Symbian4.
 

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danramos is offline danramos
2010-07-20 , 09:49
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#233
Originally Posted by siperkin View Post
I think that Nokia should use the Android wave to boost the profile of Meego. Start a rumour of a handset with Android then launch it with Meego, assuming its a fully polished version, and isn't going to backfire.
Ah yes.

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo.

Yeah, I don't think that would go over very well at all. Especially when they go to look at what it can do and whether you can find the same type of useful apps (Yelp, Facebook, Sky Maps, Google Goggles, Google Navigation, etc.)

I mean.. heh.. Ovi Maps isn't going to knock their socks off.
 

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gerbick
2010-07-20 , 12:42
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#234
I just wanted to take the time to say a very public thanks to wmarone for sharing his views in a very clear, open manner with me. I don't think we oppose each other as much as we just have different views and you've always spoken your side without having to dive into "you're a troll" or other silly rhetoric - which is rather easy to fall into.
 

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attila77 is offline attila77
2010-07-20 , 13:04
Posts: 3,319 | Thanked: 5,610 times | Joined on Aug 2008 @ Finland
#235
Originally Posted by BatPenguin View Post
I just don't see how anybody can really claim that Meego is backed by a "neutral party". It's backed by Nokia and Intel, what is so neutral about that? Meego is Nokia and Intel's baby, Android is Google's. Yes, yes, Linux Foundation this and that -- is the Linux foundation employing the developers any more than the Open Handset Allience is for Android? Imagining Meego as some champion of freedom is just silly nonsense. It's all about the companies behind the associations, those who employ the developers. Maybe you prefer Nokia to Google but it's hardly "neutral".
Obviously SOMEONE has to back it, and it's Nokia's and Intel's job to kickstart. The fully open phase can start only once the foundations are set up and people see something enticing, and then they can really embark on infiltrating the MeeGo pyramid. That's when it will, at least in theory, become truly neutral and set off to conquer the world. The Linux Foundation and all that stuff is there to minimize the fears of rug-pulling - Google is way more instrumental in Android/OHA. That's the idea, anyway, we'll see how things turn out
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smoku is offline smoku
2010-07-20 , 13:10
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#236
Originally Posted by msa View Post
openness isnt always a plus. it sure isnt a minus, but what are the advantages that we as the maemo-community in general (and the n900-community specifically) have?
a freakin lot of half-baked hobby-apps that dont work. now i dont want to disrespect the free time and effort all the developers put in their apps, but to me as the consumer, unfinished apps arent helpful to me..
Don't ask what the community can do for you.
Ask what you can do for the community.

Then, you'll understand.
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smoku is offline smoku
2010-07-20 , 13:14
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#237
Originally Posted by gerbick View Post
This indirectly leads to my real question. If Nokia won't use Android - as stated before in order to preserve their "unique" ecosystem and/or environment - then why would any manufacturer use MeeGo?
You don't have to sign your firstborn to Google.
Just take the code and put it on your hardware.
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Laughing Man is offline Laughing Man
2010-07-20 , 13:27
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#238
I don't think your even required to use Google's services. I think the problem with Cyanogen was they were re-destributing ROMS with Google's services already baked in.
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Originally Posted by ysss View Post
They're maemo and MeeGo...

"Meamo!" sounds like what Zorro would say to catherine zeta jones... after she slaps him for looking at her dirtily...
 

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ColonelKilkenny is offline ColonelKilkenny
2010-07-20 , 13:33
Posts: 39 | Thanked: 47 times | Joined on Aug 2009 @ Tampere, Finland
#239
Originally Posted by BatPenguin View Post
Maybe you prefer Nokia to Google but it's hardly "neutral".
It is as neutral as it can be. No code allowed unless it's upstream (and upstream isn't controlled by Nokia or Intel) etc.

Originally Posted by BatPenguin View Post
... it's not too far-fetched to see Android phones from Nokia sometime pretty soon or other very large re-arrangements, maybe a Windows phone with Microsoft. Just stick the Ovi stuff on Android/Windows and roll with it while desperately trying to build up Symbian4/Meego, if they decide to keep both. A new CEO simply cannot avoid making big changes. Since S60 is already on its way down to featurephones it doesn't really leave a lot of options for the short-term. Meego's not ready for phones and even if they manage to push out another beta device before the end of the year, it probably won't really be ready for challenging the competition much sooner than Symbian4.
Choosing a new CEO, switching to Android, developing apps that run on Dalvik, hiring / training the people to do the actual coding (or transferring Qt to Android), developing new phones from the scratch (I doubt they can just decide to switch OS on a work-in-progress phone...), train all QA, support, sales, ... , marketing people for the new platform, etc. etc. etc. before Symbian 4 is ready for devices?

If Nokia decides now to produce one flagship Android device it's probably released about the same time Symbian^7 is ready or something like that

+ Switching to Android now would be a total and utter sign of total failure. Android train has already left the station and Nokia didn't want to ride it.

And we all know that MeeGo will be much more awesome than Android
 

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smoku is offline smoku
2010-07-20 , 13:35
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#240
Originally Posted by Laughing Man View Post
I don't think your even required to use Google's services. I think the problem with Cyanogen was they were re-destributing ROMS with Google's services already baked in.
I'm talking about private code branches.
I guess NITdroid folks could tel you some stories about porting Android to new hardware without access to those.
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