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2014-08-29
, 00:23
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Posts: 114 |
Thanked: 37 times |
Joined on Aug 2014
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#252
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Originally Posted by JulmaHerra
Of course, but it seems common courtesy to tell what is being done to it. Maybe they did in a repair report, but then if so, why not just tell it to those many who asked - isn't TJC for those kinds of interactions. The secrecy seems unnecessary and impolite.
If my SIM-card slot is not working, I surely know why I'm sending it to be repaired, don't I?
Also, information is important to know whether or not the issue will be fixed for good, or perhaps mended for the time being. Sometimes companies use warranty service to do something to the device, even before a real solution is available (resulting in several visits to the shop). It would be useful for the discerning customer to know more about the likelihood of getting it fixed at that time or perhaps waiting a little longer.
Originally Posted by JulmaHerra
Of course the line has to be drawn somewhere and not all can be pleased. I'm offering the opinion that the line should be drawn a little more towards the transparent. Frankly, quite often it is a common sense thing, really. Reading the TJC thread on the SIM card holder, I do feel the common sense thing would have been to explain something to those who had been waiting for the resolution.
Problem is that you define that balance in one way, others define it the other way. End result is that it's impossible to strike a balance that suits everybody. Now the line has been drawn somewhere and it doesn't suit you, even if it's about information which wouldn't help the community in any way (because everything relating to fixing it are out of community's hands, being hardware and not software issue). I simply don't see any sense on concentrating so much effort extracting information that you cannot use in any sensible way. I would understand this criticism if it was about some software bits or architectural things which prevent people of making new apps or getting things to work.
If for example you have been waiting for a delayed flight at the airport, airlines do tell you what was fixed in the plane or why it was delayed, even though you do nothing with that information - certainly much less than you could do with a SIM card holder issue where at least you can stuff some cardboard in there or something. It is common courtesy, it is common sense and it is the right thing to do.
Not explaining anything just leaves a very odd taste in the mouth. But kudos to Philippe for finally offering some information on this.
Originally Posted by JulmaHerra
I agree that they can do better.
There are always disgruntled people. It's a fact of life, you simply cannot please them all and if you try to do it, you end up pleasing nobody. Can they do better? Probably. However, putting effort on deeply explaining some SIM-card problem just because "it's nice to know" is not about improving things but adding noise.
But the SIM card holder example matters exactly because of that. Clearly, for whatever reason, it was an exercise in controlling the information passed out - and that's an area where, in general, I feel Jolla would do themselves a favor by loosening the strings somewhat. It is just example out of several, as has been discussed in the thread. I think some added transparency and "brutal honesty" (as jalyst put it) would resonate better with a larger group of people in this early adopter phase.
Last edited by pango; 2014-08-29 at 00:25.
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2014-08-29
, 00:37
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Posts: 114 |
Thanked: 37 times |
Joined on Aug 2014
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#253
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Originally Posted by benny1967
Sure, so goes the common line. In reality, more transparent communications would mostly be at the expense of fluffy tweets, not really any other work.
I'd prefer those people to work
How long would it take to pen an honest the goodness short, informative update on some topic. Not long, that's for sure. In that SIM card holder case, it probably took them longer - as in more time away from that work you talk of - to formulate how to express themselves without providing an actual explanation.
But more importantly, whenever that lack of comms results later in some PR crisis, that will take time away from more important work. The fk_lx case surely has taken some time away from a lot of people and I think that too could have been handled better by addressing it earlier. I think it would be wise to ratchet up the transparency a little, so that less issues would rise to the crisis map and thus take time away from real work.
Now, I'm not suggesting not paying any attention to how or what is communicated. I'm just following jalyst's suggestion to notch back the fluffy stuff a little and replace it with a little more timely brutal honesty:
http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p...1&postcount=29
Originally Posted by benny1967
I am neither entertained or care at all about myself in this thread. I would like to see Jolla succeed and as part of that I've made the attempt to explain what and why I suggest - and why I found jalyst's suggestion (surely he is a neutral voice in this?) a compelling one.
, not to cater to your ego and entertain you as we do.
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2014-08-29
, 09:21
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Posts: 337 |
Thanked: 891 times |
Joined on Jul 2012
@ Royaume Uni.
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#254
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Originally Posted by pango
No it doesn't.
Of course, but it seems common courtesy to tell what is being done to it.
I had problems with my Nexus 5 recently, I sent it into the shop and they sent the device back refusing to fix it as they said it had water damage (it most certainly did not!). No diagnosis was given - the only option I was given was to refurbish the phone, but that would cost £180!
Same thing happened with Nokia. We all know about the infamous USB port failure issue that plagued the N900/E7. Well, when my N900 packed in, I was forced to accept an E7 and given no choice or reason why. My E7 then failed 1 month after the warranty expired, I went to Nokia care and they told me to piss off.
My experience with Jolla on the otherhand has been very good. While I haven't had a hardware issue, I did have the annoying battery drain issue. I complained (as did others) and it was fixed very quickly. The other issue I had was with Android apps crashing/failing to work, I complained again and the issue while not completely fixed, was certainly improved upon.
My only issue now is with the native browser, which simply isn't as good as Chrome for Android. If that can be improved, then I will have pretty much the device I want.
Overall though, I am happy with the support that Jolla are providing. Compared to other device manufacturers I have purchased from, I have to say it's some of the best support I have had.
Last edited by NokiaFanatic; 2014-08-29 at 09:29.
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2014-08-29
, 10:52
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Posts: 7,075 |
Thanked: 9,073 times |
Joined on Oct 2009
@ Moon! It's not the East or the West side... it's the Dark Side
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#255
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Originally Posted by benny1967
Please use some of your fame to get the copy and paste snowball Rollin...
OMG! I'm famous!
Just to set things straight:
When I said Marc wasn't Jesus I didn't mean to express any doubt about His divinity. Don't punish me!
...
__________________
Do something for the climate today! Anything!
I don't trust poeple without a Nokia n900...
Do something for the climate today! Anything!
I don't trust poeple without a Nokia n900...
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2014-08-29
, 14:18
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Posts: 114 |
Thanked: 37 times |
Joined on Aug 2014
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#256
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Originally Posted by NokiaFanatic
You do realize that common courtesy doesn't mean everyone lives up to it? What you just described are two instances far from common courtesy and indeed unfortunate. One would wish we'd get better from the likes of Jolla, especially on the CTO level. Maybe some outsourced repair shop guy in an individual case can be excused easier for not living up to a standard, but a CTO on a site called together.jolla.com could probably be expected to be a little more transparent, together...
No it doesn't.Originally Posted by pango View Post
Of course, but it seems common courtesy to tell what is being done to it.
I had problems with my Nexus 5 recently, I sent it into the shop and they sent the device back refusing to fix it as they said it had water damage (it most certainly did not!). No diagnosis was given - the only option I was given was to refurbish the phone, but that would cost £180!
Same thing happened with Nokia. We all know about the infamous USB port failure issue that plagued the N900/E7. Well, when my N900 packed in, I was forced to accept an E7 and given no choice or reason why. My E7 then failed 1 month after the warranty expired, I went to Nokia care and they told me to piss off.
As for liquid damage, I have often received photographs of liquid damaged components - and always a report of what has been swapped or repaired - when visiting maintenance shops, Nokia or otherwise. Probably a Jolla SIM card holder repair also puts out some repair report, it would have been nice to get that info beforehand in the relevant TJC thread.
Originally Posted by NokiaFanatic
That, of course, is nice to hear.
Overall though, I am happy with the support that Jolla are providing. Compared to other device manufacturers I have purchased from, I have to say it's some of the best support I have had.
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2014-08-30
, 07:38
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Posts: 252 |
Thanked: 597 times |
Joined on Oct 2011
@ Denmark
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#258
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Originally Posted by NokiaFanatic
Have you tried the Webcat browser?
My only issue now is with the native browser, which simply isn't as good as Chrome for Android. If that can be improved, then I will have pretty much the device I want.
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2014-08-31
, 19:07
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Posts: 114 |
Thanked: 37 times |
Joined on Aug 2014
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#259
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Just to kind of give a little FOSS perspective to this issue, check out this IRC log:
http://www.merproject.org/logs/%23ne...06-24T20:58:08
I think there certainly is some food for thought there for Jolla. If the FOSS community is voicing this, if some in the consumer perspective (like myself mostly) is voicing this, and even - shudder, horror - fk_lx is voicing this, maybe it is something to think about instead of just laugh off with a GIF or two.
No?
http://www.merproject.org/logs/%23ne...06-24T20:58:08
I think there certainly is some food for thought there for Jolla. If the FOSS community is voicing this, if some in the consumer perspective (like myself mostly) is voicing this, and even - shudder, horror - fk_lx is voicing this, maybe it is something to think about instead of just laugh off with a GIF or two.
No?
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2014-08-31
, 19:15
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Posts: 7,075 |
Thanked: 9,073 times |
Joined on Oct 2009
@ Moon! It's not the East or the West side... it's the Dark Side
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#260
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Originally Posted by pango
So what should jolla do and how?
Just to kind of give a little FOSS perspective to this issue, check out this IRC log:
http://www.merproject.org/logs/%23ne...06-24T20:58:08
I think there certainly is some food for thought there for Jolla. If the FOSS community is voicing this, if some in the consumer perspective (like myself mostly) is voicing this, and even - shudder, horror - fk_lx is voicing this, maybe it is something to think about instead of just laugh off with a GIF or two.
No?
"also it does not help, that jolla essentially has raped the term "open" PR wise like any other corporation has done before. there, I said it out loud."
Haha love this line. Not sure that a fully agree or maybe I do, Ticky question. But I do love the line. Good one.
__________________
Do something for the climate today! Anything!
I don't trust poeple without a Nokia n900...
Do something for the climate today! Anything!
I don't trust poeple without a Nokia n900...
Last edited by Dave999; 2014-08-31 at 19:25.
I was surprised by the controlling attitude when it came to blogger relations, that is true. Maybe I still expected a more easy, more agile approach from Jolla. As said, maybe I shouldn't have been surprised. They do seem to have a very controlled image, part of which is may of course be related to their unwillingness to host certain discussions in public.