I'd be more than happy to. But I'll be damned if I'll stand around while someone throws mud when they're half the reason there's mud in the first place.

I point you to my last post. It's been asked a dozen plus times already, in a variety of ways. The last time I personally asked was in January, before I left the Board. But no doubt it was raised again recently. We can no doubt ask again once the guard changes (assuming we can figure out who to talk to then), but I'm willing to bet good money that the answer won't change. And in the mean time, the constant reiteration of "we should ask again" and "we should be able to host these" is frankly tiring and annoying.

It's as if people think HiFo, for some odd reason, WANTS to not host these files. For what purpose? And if you know that those trying to secure the future are trying to make this happen, and are no doubt frustrated that there's not progress going on, why do you think constantly bring it up and rehashing it will help?

The horse is dead. It's been whipped so long while dead that it's now a fine powder, and people are complaining that their whip is getting dirty. How is any of this helping the horse, or them?

Anyway... No worries about me. I'm pretty much out of here. Have been for a while. Enjoy your powdered horse.

PS: Got to love someone calling to "STOP GOING OFF TOPIC", and then posting a reply continuing the off-topic conversation. Winner!

PPS: I don't give a flying fùck about infraction points or bans. Guess why...

Yes, but you're not answering my Qns in that post directly, how do we know it'll stand up in a court, it's not like it could be easily proven that HiFo's the one doing the illegal hosting.
And even if it could (I'd like to hear exactly how), what's the likely outcome of bringing HiFo members to justice given that many (all?) don't live in the US, sure the registered entity could be shutdown -maybe.
Once we know that it def. will stand up, & that the registered entity could be easily shutdown as-a-result, then perhaps we can start looking at getting the whole thing set-up outside the US?

And then there's the massive likelihood that no one will really give a flap that we're hosting that stuff illegally, so long as HiFo/Council isn't commercially gaining from that (3rd-party) hosting?
Perhaps the host could even add an extra layer to the site, where-by downloaders agree to not use any of the proprietary bits for commercial gain, not that anyone is going to in reality!

You're the only one claiming this Joerg... Call it a lie all you want. You keep bringing it up... Nobody else. Funny that.

I frankly can't be bothered to try to figure out WTF you're talking about here. I'm sure what you're saying makes sense in some language, or in whatever crazy you think in. But I'm beyond caring or trying to figure it out. "Not my circus, not my monkies," as the kids say these days.

The end all is this:
HiFo, and the servers that are running under HiFo's see, can not host the images. If they do, it will effectively end HiFo, and shortly after will end the website. Anything you say will not change this.

Because "the community" and "the Council" are not legal entities. Nokia did not enter into negotiations with either of those because they could not legally negotiate with them. Had HiFo not existed, Nokia would have just shut the ****ing servers OFF, and been done with it.

As for HiFo "explaining" this, it was very clearly explained early on as a concern. It was also clearly expressed to Council and Techstaff. This has been an open topic of conversation for damn near a year now, if not longer. People were complaining to Nokia about the images being gone since Nemien disabled the servers a month or two before the hand over. It took months until Techstaff accidentally "fixed" the problem, and a month or two for Nokia to notice it and make the request that we disable it again.

You of all people should know that, having been involved in every step of that process. Ah, but wait... you were informed. And used that information against HiFo every chance you got.

No... I don't blame you for anything but what you've done directly. It's not your fault that Nokia is choosing to hold back some items. And it's not your fault that they didn't want to deal with a random legally unbindable community.

But it IS you who's done nothing but attack others and stir the **** for most of the past year. Part of it may confusion, between language issues, and misunderstandings. But the vast majority of it is you being an ornery old cuss with control issues, who refuses to listen to anyone else and demands to be in charge of every decision made. All the while backstabing anyone the second they didn't fall in line with your view of how things should be done.

You did it in OM, you're doing it here, no doubt Neo900 will fail for the same reasons. There's a reason I didn't put money into Neo900: Fool me once....

Good luck old man. You're going to need it.

Mods: Feel free to ban me for a "personal attack". I won't be back.

on a sidenote about "OFF TOPIC":
claiming that some post is off topic and asking the OP to not do this doesn't forbid answering such post. If it was, all trolls would have a really convenient way to sprwead whatever they like, by just posting off topic to random threads, and nobody would dare to answer.

Accordingly I ask moderators to move the whole rant part since maybe http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p...&postcount=130 (and maybe also a previous section that also started with a rant of Woody answering my statement re stepping down from admin coordinator) to another new thread, since this thread is about technical issues strictly related to maemo.org and addressed at techstaff.

Oh FFS stop talking to each other, please...
Lets just focus on a solution, however imperfect it may ultimately have to be.
Please see my post above your last post Woody...

What part of this are you not getting? This isn't about some random server. This is about making the images available ON MAEMO SERVERS. PERIOD.

I could give a **** if someone decides to put them on bittorrent or what not. But if ANYTHING gets traced back to HiFo: One bit of it is served from those servers, or funding from HiFo's accounts goes to someone who then turns out to be linked in ANY WAY to this, HiFo will be named in the suit. It's how business operates.

And guess who lives in the US... And has their name on the startup papers, and was on the Board. But sure... why not just FÛCK all those ignorant bastards in the US who were trying to help out. Who gives a flying **** about them?

Thanks pal... no really... With friends like that...

THIS HAS ALREADY BEEN ASKED ABOUT! THERE WAS ALREADY A DISCLAIMER OFFERED!

This is like a 13 yo girl asking her parents to go to a party every damn day, and them saying no. Then she slips out and is suprised when her parents show up at the party and ground her. Who would have known?

NOKIA ALREADY NOTICED THIS ONCE, AND ASKED US TO KNOCK IT OFF.

But then since nobody follows any of the logged council meetings, where this was all openly discussed months ago.... It's all HiFos fault for not "informing the public" about it....

Wow...

The level of ****ery here is deep. "We could ask." x 400. And if not, we could still do it, they won't care. And if anyone gets in trouble it would just be those poor bastards in the US, that tried to arrange to make this all work in the first place.

**** it. I vote to shut it all down. To hell with it. Close HiFo, to **** with the money, let the bank keep it for all I care. And let Nokia send a cease and desist letter to IPHH, and it all goes away.

That's where this is headed.

One last time: STOP SPREADING LIES!! (I quoted the one here as an example as it is blatantly clear that you have no damn idea about what I did in OpenMoko back in the times this company existed, since you didn't even know me the time I been with OpenMoko. Actually your whole post consists of 80% lies and false statements and 20% insult and bashing)
I'm honestly considering what can legally get done against your planned damage and character assassination. I guess not even your damn weird US laws allow this.

I updated that post you just responded to woody...
Also, I think you need to relax just a little with the aggressive_tone/personal_insults, just trying to step through things logically here, tis nothing personal.
First to admit I haven't always followed things closely, but, the more heads that understand the entire picture, the better the chances of devising a workable (if not ideal) solution.
Can't hurt to lay-it-all-out (again) in one place, for a much larger grouping of folks to read, I do understand your frustration, & I do appreciate what you've tried to do in the past.
I'll address your latest post, later....

@joer

None of this should be moved, it's pertinent to this thread*, except many of the posts should prolly be edited by mods to include only factual info, no personal attacks or character assassinations.

*we must be "locked in this room together" until things are nutted out

I read... But it doesn't change anything. Even if it's hosted outside the US, if it can be linked back, they will go after HiFo.


Sorry, I tend to get a little defensive when people say things like "who cares if they go after people in the US", considering how tied I am to this mess still. And yes, even not being on the Board right now, they can STILL go after me legally for several years after the fact if they want to.

It's great that you can just nonchalantly say "ah, who cares". But then that's part of the issue here. Everyone all happy and ready to jump on the "let's be illegal" bandwagon, because they have no skin in the game if things go bad. Without giving the faintest concern for those that might wind up in a bad place because of their actions.


Yes, actually.. It can. This is not the first thread in TMO on this topic. This has in fact been THE primary point of conversation for the past 6+ months. In Council, on the Board, in every Council meeting, in a number of TMO threads... It's the reason I stepped down from the Board!

I just don't get how to make it clearer. This issue has been around for over a year. It's been rehashed in every forum imaginable: e-mail, irc, meetings, TMO.

It boils down to this: We tried every possible legal option to keep these files hosted somewhere. Nokia is NOT going to change their tune on this, especially not this late in the game. And as these files DO find their way into file sharing and the likes, HiFo must remain well detached from those doing so.

This very discussion thread, all by itself, could in fact be used as evidence later if any of the people partaking in it run for Board. Or there's even a remote linkage between HiFo and the sharing going on.

Anyway... I'm done. Calling this a wrap.

Good luck.

Maybe I'll go have a drink with Rob this weekend. At this rate I may need a lawyer friend in PA.