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2016-09-04
, 01:00
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Posts: 634 |
Thanked: 3,266 times |
Joined on May 2010
@ Colombia
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#22
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Originally Posted by Ken-Young
I'd like to think that part of the problem is that the usual operating systems that are installed on Raspberry Pis lack the power management that something like Maemo has. This is a software problem and is fixable.
Sadly, Raspberry Pis are quite power-hungry. You'd need a really large battery to actually make a smartphone you could use for a full day. Notice that the guy in the video doesn't keep it powered up all the time.
Also, the Raspberry Pi Zero which was suggested, draws significantly less power than the traditional model B series. I'd personally like to see a phone built from the Pi Compute Module (draws a bit more power than the Zero but not close to model B). It's easier to embed than the Zero and can potentially be upgraded. A new Compute Module based on the Pi 3 is due in a few months.
There's a lot going for the Raspberry Pi and it's community is huge compared to ours. I think a Pi phone has potential to be successful if done right. I bet the Android Pi community would love to have a Pi phone.
__________________
DebiaN900 - Native Debian on the N900. Deprecated in favour of Maemo Leste.
Maemo Leste for N950 and N9 (currently broken).
Devuan for N950 and N9.
Mobile devices with mainline Linux support - Help needed with documentation.
"Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly." - Henry Spencer
Maemo Leste for N950 and N9 (currently broken).
Devuan for N950 and N9.
Mobile devices with mainline Linux support - Help needed with documentation.
"Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly." - Henry Spencer
Last edited by wicket; 2016-09-04 at 01:33.
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2016-09-04
, 01:32
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Posts: 654 |
Thanked: 2,368 times |
Joined on Jul 2014
@ UK
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#23
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Originally Posted by nthn
Don't forget that the price includes continued open support.
It's extremely expensive (and also too big).
Fairphone is doing most of the things that people on this forum claim they want a manufacturer to do (open access to source for the hardware as far as they can etc.).
I guess it shows how much all the talk about "open hardware is the most important thing" is worth, when people start complaining that it costs more than the competition
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2016-09-04
, 02:30
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Posts: 110 |
Thanked: 362 times |
Joined on May 2014
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#24
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Originally Posted by wicket
Suspend power consumption is dominated by ram refresh.
I'd like to think that part of the problem is that the usual operating systems that are installed on Raspberry Pis lack the power management that something like Maemo has. This is a software problem and is fixable.
Also, the Raspberry Pi Zero which was suggested, draws significantly less power than the traditional model B series. I'd personally like to see a phone built from the Pi Compute Module (draws a bit more power than the Zero but not close to model B). It's easier to embed than the Zero and can potentially be upgraded. A new Compute Module based on the Pi 3 is due in a few months.
There's a lot going for the Raspberry Pi and it's community is huge compared to ours. I think a Pi phone has potential to be successful if done right. I bet the Android Pi community would love to have a Pi phone.
There are hardware differences in ram, lpddr consumes 3 times less than ddr.
On an atmel a5 for example suspend to ram with lpddr is 9-15 ma @ 3.3V, with normal ram around 33-40 ma.
The Pi Zero is currently at 100 ma (AFAIK). Would be amazing if someone could fix this to 10ma, but i wont hold my breath on this issue. And the newer versions, powerwise, are going in the wrong direction.
So if you want to build something in the pi range with power management you might consider something like this
http://www.micro-technic.com/Webshop...A5D3X-MT0.html
or
http://www.emacinc.com/products/syst...dule/SoM-A5D36
lpddr2 seems to be a rare commodity, somewhere i read the DIPFORTy2 "All Programmable Linux" is "delayed", because even 64MB lpddr2 seems hard to get.
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2016-09-04
, 03:04
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Posts: 959 |
Thanked: 3,427 times |
Joined on Apr 2012
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#25
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Originally Posted by pythoneye2
Does the Pi have multiple RAM chips? If so, I wonder if some sort of hybrid suspend would be possible, where all but one of them are swapped off to flash memory and powered down.
Suspend power consumption is dominated by ram refresh.
There are hardware differences in ram, lpddr consumes 3 times less than ddr.
On an atmel a5 for example suspend to ram with lpddr is 9-15 ma @ 3.3V, with normal ram around 33-40 ma.
The Pi Zero is currently at 100 ma (AFAIK). Would be amazing if someone could fix this to 10ma, but i wont hold my breath on this issue. And the newer versions, powerwise, are going in the wrong direction.
So if you want to build something in the pi range with power management you might consider something like this
http://www.micro-technic.com/Webshop...A5D3X-MT0.html
or
http://www.emacinc.com/products/syst...dule/SoM-A5D36
lpddr2 seems to be a rare commodity, somewhere i read the DIPFORTy2 "All Programmable Linux" is "delayed", because even 64MB lpddr2 seems hard to get.
__________________
Saera: A Siri clone for the N900, N9(50) and Jolla
Follow me on Twitter: twitter.com/taixzo
Saera: A Siri clone for the N900, N9(50) and Jolla
Follow me on Twitter: twitter.com/taixzo
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2016-09-04
, 04:56
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Posts: 634 |
Thanked: 3,266 times |
Joined on May 2010
@ Colombia
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#26
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Originally Posted by pythoneye2
Apparently the Pi 3 uses LPDDR2:
Suspend power consumption is dominated by ram refresh.
There are hardware differences in ram, lpddr consumes 3 times less than ddr.
On an atmel a5 for example suspend to ram with lpddr is 9-15 ma @ 3.3V, with normal ram around 33-40 ma.
The Pi Zero is currently at 100 ma (AFAIK). Would be amazing if someone could fix this to 10ma, but i wont hold my breath on this issue. And the newer versions, powerwise, are going in the wrong direction.
So if you want to build something in the pi range with power management you might consider something like this
http://www.micro-technic.com/Webshop...A5D3X-MT0.html
or
http://www.emacinc.com/products/syst...dule/SoM-A5D36
lpddr2 seems to be a rare commodity, somewhere i read the DIPFORTy2 "All Programmable Linux" is "delayed", because even 64MB lpddr2 seems hard to get.
http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/proces...-kits/8968660/
Of course it now has other niceties like a faster CPU, wireless LAN and Bluetooth which consume extra power.
__________________
DebiaN900 - Native Debian on the N900. Deprecated in favour of Maemo Leste.
Maemo Leste for N950 and N9 (currently broken).
Devuan for N950 and N9.
Mobile devices with mainline Linux support - Help needed with documentation.
"Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly." - Henry Spencer
Maemo Leste for N950 and N9 (currently broken).
Devuan for N950 and N9.
Mobile devices with mainline Linux support - Help needed with documentation.
"Those who do not understand Unix are condemned to reinvent it, poorly." - Henry Spencer
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2016-09-04
, 05:35
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Posts: 387 |
Thanked: 1,700 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
@ Cambridge, MA, USA
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#27
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Originally Posted by pythoneye2
Yes, the Pis are optimized for low cost, not low power. They allow a whole new class of projects to be done. But you can't just tweek the software and make them low power too.
[...]
The Pi Zero is currently at 100 ma (AFAIK). Would be amazing if someone could fix this to 10ma, but i wont hold my breath on this issue. And the newer versions, powerwise, are going in the wrong direction.
[...]
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2016-09-04
, 05:44
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Posts: 1,671 |
Thanked: 11,478 times |
Joined on Jun 2008
@ Warsaw, Poland
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#28
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http://www.ingenic.com/en/?newton/id/13.html is one of the more interesting kits I've encountered over time.
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2016-09-04
, 06:43
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Posts: 764 |
Thanked: 2,888 times |
Joined on Jun 2014
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#29
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Originally Posted by Feathers McGraw
It's a great idea and I'd love for all manufacturers to go in the same direction so prices would be lower, but for now, if I can't afford it, I can't support it. If we want to talk about 'our' device, it should be something which doesn't cost a fortune, otherwise whose device is it really?
Don't forget that the price includes continued open support.
Fairphone is doing most of the things that people on this forum claim they want a manufacturer to do (open access to source for the hardware as far as they can etc.).
I guess it shows how much all the talk about "open hardware is the most important thing" is worth, when people start complaining that it costs more than the competition
| The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to nthn For This Useful Post: | ||
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2016-09-04
, 07:00
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Posts: 1,293 |
Thanked: 4,319 times |
Joined on Oct 2014
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#30
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Hmm mix that idea with a provider (GSM) service, that profits from bitcoin, etherum or similar mining. Giving free talk/data service world-wide ?
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There's a reason the GTA04, neo900 etc have not had great successes. Building a cell phone just isn't something a few friends can do in their spare time.