I don't care if it comes with terminal or not out of the box.
I just hope they still release the phone as planned...

A lot of senseless discussion regarding packaging, maemo or MeeGo, *.deb or *.rpm - since more than a year now...

...I'm getting a really, really bad feeling regarding the DRM system and what this could cause as soon as everybody knows how it will harm us...

Its 2011 most seems like old hw... and not even touchscreen whom will buy that? not me....

not only was it pre-installed, it was right there on the desktop. now that's l33t.

It's hard to hold an entire community to one side of a binary choice. If you're finding the same individuals have expressed both the above sentiments, then it would be interesting to know why their views have changed. Otherwise, you can't rule out the variety stemming from simply different people possessing different views, especially since the community has a massive turnover in active posters during the lifetime of the N900.

We have our fair share of both "Flash or die" and "Flash must die" members, for instance. They seem to appear in waves in any thread that touches upon the plug-in.

Personally, I agree with you that a device without a bundled X term would be a step back. On the other hand, I can understand the average phone buyer might see an X term as ranking among the most useless applications imaginable. Therefore, I'd be satisfied by a hidden, hotkey-accessible one.

It's been confirmed that it is as open as N900 - not speculation.

I honestly find no comfort in that sentiment.

If it happens, one way or the other, it'll be a positive. As long as something happens beyond rumors and whatnot.

I'm not holding a community to some binary "you're for it/you're against it" type of sentiment. I just am not up for giving Nokia any room from what should be delivered that will earn my money.

When it comes to stocks, right now is the best time to buy Nokia cause I think it bottomed out and is now valued more inline with what it is worth. The dividends they pay seems to be well worth it at the price they are now. Nokia shares will grow again whether slowly by proceeding with the current transition and going towards WP7 or by merging or by being outright bought by a competitor, the stock has a value proposition now.

The N9 is pointless, they can rather throw a WP7 OS and recoup more out of the chassis then waste it on future disruptions. A company with money and rosy future like Apple can look towards future disruptions Nokia cannot afford to shamelessly throw around money for such a device. The Meego/ Maemo/ Harmattan talk is quite childish and folks need to grow up. Nokia cannot deliver on this promise, look towards the silver lining that other phone makers are in need of options with the small margins that Android provides. I hope to see Meego become the alternative royalty free OS for these companies, and also tap into as Elop said future disruptions in regards with IVI's, home automation, landlines, tv's, and other household appliances. Everyday equipment will at one time require an embedded OS and Android has captured this segment, but their remains a gigantic room for Meego to also grow within this ecosystem.

I am disappointed with Nokia as they have made mistakes from the past which hindered it. Elop has done a lot to steer it towards new dangers although the difference is he seems to have more short term goals and objectives. The guys before him had long term visions and nebulous ways of carrying that out. I see Elop has calculated strategic goals which will have deliverables. The danger is that the situation is bad when you do a transition when a transition was already ongoing. It is also bad when Symbian has an obituary page reserved, and all of Nokia's eggs are on S40 and WP7. I have a WP7 phone, it is a refreshing OS and I actually like it because it is spritely. But I hold reservations, chief amongst them is being beholden to the MS sandbox where MS interests come above all. An example I previously gave is how WP7 uses services which are of another competitors. I love Google talk, but I am sure MS will never come with it baked in like how Maemo does it. Facebook integration exists because I believe Facebook and Microsoft are in an ad relationship, the same couldn't be said with Twitter although in Mango this is expected to change. The Mango release will be more than happy to throw in AIM and Messenger but not Google Talk or other Google services which people have become acclimated to. This is fair when competing, but it is never in the consumers best interests ... and this focus on dictating what consumers can and can't use is what is the true cost of playing in the MS sandbox. The most critical danger is that Nokia will not have a prominent product for the last 2 years since Maemo was dumped for Meego. I know the N8 and other phones have come since that day, but they all have had a lackluster reception and none of them had anything new to deliver ... aside the 12mp camera of the N8 and the sexy form factor of the ridiculously pricey E7 ... they each got panned for not having specs worth mentioning and an OS which is still not friendly to the touch interface. Since Feb of last year when Meego came into existence till now, Nokia has not yet once produced a phone that is comparable spec wise to the competing brands of it's time. Now Nokia is still waiting to build out a WP7 device and we wait till Q4 to see it. This will be the biggest danger, that nobody cares when the new devices come into existence.

I ultimately believe the real problems are because of OPK. He did not do the transition fast enough, nor did he play a true leadership role unlike Elop is doing right now ... I hate everything he has done but the guy is exuding confidence and steadfast resolve. OPK was dithering and non-comittal ... he tried to appease everyone like a true engineer would do ... but nothing gets done when you appease everyone. Ovi, come with music were all good ideas but with horrible execution and implementation. The biggest mistake was proceeding with Meego, a new distro which ultimately started from scratch. Maemo was there fully ready and with some touch ups and minor tweaks and updates could of become a real contender 3 or 4 devices down and with a couple more iterations. The geniuses at Nokia decided it was more fruitful to go with intel, scrap maemo, and design from the beginning again ... wtf are you kidding me? That was stupid, and every individual involved in that process has to be considered inept. What was the benefits?

The benefits as attributed to Jim Zemlin;

1) Maemo was mobile OS, but functioned and behaved much like a desktop OS. Recreating this under the name of Meego was pointless. Also Nokia makes cell phones, why would they waste their time creating IVI and Desktop OS's when their bread and butter is phones. For future devices it makes sense, but for Nokia they wasted too much time in thinking about the future and forgetting the present. Maemo fit their current need, and could of been fashioned to fit future needs.

2) Makes sense, but doesn't explain why Moblin and Maemo could not do it individually. Joining up and starting from the beginning was and still is pointless. Each OS was open source and each OEM could take upon themselves to create such governing standards like the open handset alliance.

3 and 4) Pretty much came with Maemo, didn't add anything new.

So it begs to ask the question, what did Moblin bring with it? What was the point? It seems like the guys over at Nokia especially the Maemo devision were incompetent or saw a set of values which haven't been explained nor has come to fruition. With that strong feeling although, it doesn't make good business sense now to reincarnate anything Maemo. They already spent money on Meego and Meego has a broader platform reach, so as hard as it is Nokia must ensure Meego succeeds as well.

Also the broader set of questions is who authorized Maemo's benching. Who initiated contacts for Meego? Were they coerced or was this a transaction? More details of the Nokia/ Intel union has to come to light. Something smelt fishy of that deal from day one and has had far reaching repercussions such as forcing Elop's hand to go to another OS. Elop must have done an evaluation process and he may have seen that Meego could not be delivered as expected, and would start out fundamentally weak, especially in a market where Nokia remains losing money for quite some time. WP7 probably provided the best alternative in stemming the loss of capital. WP7 is the band-aid solution to a problem that still needs hospitalization.

The N9/N950 should not be released with anything Meego nor Maemo. Why release a phone that is destined to be panned by critics for sure. Nokia has to salvage the brand as a quality brand. Limited release makes sense, developer channel makes sense, but don't waste money on making a a single commercial Meego device without having the WP7 hype of next year to bolster Nokia's brand likeability. They should release a limited release Meego device every time Apple is making their announcement so as to undercut the Apple hype machine. Meego would get some trail off publicity and become the benchmark with which apple is compared to ... there is a marketing opportunity in there. If they do this for 3 or so years, that single line of Nokia phone will obtain a following and gain market viability to attain a commercial release. That would be my Meego strategy, to slowly gain consumer attraction with a single phone release per year model for Meego phones. They really need to duplicate Apple here, as the process they do it in really cuts down on production costs and servicing costs. The Apple model should be mimicked for Nokia Meego devices, but limited releases at first to slowly get user attention on the OS.

If you have made it this far, thanks for reading my assessment of all things Nokia. I have used a WP7 device, and seeing what the other companies are doing I see Nokia has a true winner here but they must ensure product quality, they have to work out the SD card BS that is happening with WP7 phones (streamline the issue), bring winning camera technology over because seriously the current WP7 OEM's all have horrible camera's and processing methods. The last ingredient is that Nokia has to truly learn how to get behind a product and be confident of said product. Nokia has to improve how the engage their customers and improve the warranty support system. I really hated having my phone serviced in Texas when I live in Toronto. It cost $60 for shipping and recieving, whereas my buddies with iPhones just drive to the nearest mall with an Apple store.

talk about a tl;dr

lolz - someone wandered into the wrong thread