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2011-02-16
, 09:30
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Posts: 218 |
Thanked: 128 times |
Joined on Dec 2010
@ Abu Dhabi , UAE
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#42
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Originally Posted by benny1967
Maybe you have forgot something.MS also collects personal data(Yes,even for a free flashlight app), or maybe the 3rd party.Unless you pay.Google also has the personal data collection and a big force to use a Google account,so we can trust neither of them.
Mhm... I chose Maemo because I wanted freedom. Free software, yes, but also the freedom *not* to give away my personal data.
The more I think of it, the more I believe that the freedom to keep data to myself, not having to sign up to some cloud service or having to use a certain account, is even more important than the fact that some version of the OS on my phone is open source at some stage in development.
Given a choice between Windows Phone and Android, I'd stay away from phones altogether. If I had to use one, I'd use Microsoft. Never trust Google. Never ever.
Originally Posted by Copernicus
I would like very much to believe it but the chart is showing something different
With Linux and OS X, it is beginning to make serious inroads into the personal computer market as well.
Last edited by govprog; 2011-02-16 at 11:57.
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2011-02-16
, 09:52
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Posts: 4,384 |
Thanked: 5,524 times |
Joined on Jul 2007
@ ˙ǝɹǝɥʍou
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#43
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Originally Posted by govprog
Well, I can see that the customer is notified that that particular app may access your personal info. Once you know that, you can make the decision of whether to eat that sh*t or not.
Maybe you have forgot something.MS also collects personal data(Yes,even for a free flashlight app), or maybe the 3rd party.Unless you pay.Google is also has the personal data collection and a big force to use a Google account,so we can trust neither of them.
I would like very much to believe it but the chart is showing something different
Can't say the same about unregulated appstores.
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Class .. : Power User
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Patience : [###-------] | Weapon(s): Galaxy Note + BB Bold Touch 9900
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2011-02-16
, 10:15
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Posts: 218 |
Thanked: 128 times |
Joined on Dec 2010
@ Abu Dhabi , UAE
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#44
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Originally Posted by ysss
You are right.
Well, I can see that the customer is notified that that particular app may access your personal info. Once you know that, you can make the decision of whether to eat that sh*t or not.
Can't say the same about unregulated appstores.
Originally Posted by slaapliedje
But WP7 users are rather think different from us.Some of them even think that the bing+IE9 with GPU acceleration is the best choice ever.(Better than before)
While you are correct in saying that their best products were acquired from someone else, I'd have to say the product was most likely better before MS got a hold of them. I know IE was.
Last edited by govprog; 2011-02-16 at 10:17.
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2011-02-16
, 10:16
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Posts: 1,986 |
Thanked: 7,698 times |
Joined on Dec 2010
@ Dayton, Ohio
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#45
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Originally Posted by volt
Actually, the last two paragraphs of that article sum it up better than I ever could:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10358024-16.html
So, can you now please stop making ignorant fun of people who recognize that the kernel is bigger than what is optimal on limited resources? Powerful cross-device Linux kernel comes at a cost.
One thing that I forgot to mention, but which is critical to the success of Linux, is that there really is no such thing as monolithic "Linux." Linux is highly modular and can be trimmed down/beefed up to fit a wide variety of applications...on the developers' terms, not Red Hat's, Novell's, Canonical's, etc.
So, unlike Windows, which can only be what Microsoft dictates, Linux can truly be all things to all people, as "fat" or as "skinny" as the developer wants it to be. Ubuntu is obese compared to sub-100 KB uClinux distributions, for example. Both serve different, and useful, purposes.
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2011-02-16
, 10:22
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Posts: 3,790 |
Thanked: 5,718 times |
Joined on Mar 2006
@ Vienna, Austria
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#46
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Originally Posted by govprog
There's a major difference. Of course collecting user data has become big business and many companies do it somehow. Either because it's their core business or because they just technically need your data to provide the service you asked for. (Like Nokia/Ovi will have an I of idea where I travel to if I let them read and display the geolocation of the uploaded pictures.)
Maybe you have forgot something.MS also collects personal data(Yes,even for a free flashlight app), or maybe the 3rd party.Unless you pay.Google is also has the personal data collection and a big force to use a Google account,so we can trust neither of them.
The difference between a flashlight application for WP7 or Ovi on the one hand and Google on the other is the amount of data they have about me... and the way Google collects it without telling me.
The data an Android-phone may transmit to Google only adds to what they already have. They already know which sites I visit because of Google Analytics and Google Adsense, even if I avoid the Google search engine. They know about my social network and the content of my mails/conversations if some of my friends use Google Mail/Chat accounts, even if I don't.
Now add to that whatever they learn about me if I do actually use their 'free' services (YouTube, search, docs,...).
And then, on top, comes Android: My credit card number for Google Checkout, my phone number, even more information about my contacts if I use their service to sync my data, location info, a profile of what my voice sounds like from processing voice commands.... etc.
Even if I never ever publish my real name on the web or use a "fake" Google Account, they know me as "the person who is on <my carrier/ISP>, lives in <my hometown>, has phone# <my phone number>, regularly visits <porn site> and <leftist political party site>, knows <list of some of my friends> and has access to credit card <my credit card#>." - really, that's enough to identify me and more than enough to keep me worried. Yes, I do know that Google will never search their database for my name, asking what they know about me specifically. But if governments or a secret service ask for a list of, say, "people who know person X and are on the left of the political spectrum", I might be on that list - even though I last saw person X three years ago. (And Google gets suchs requests and answers them - see their transparency report.) Once I'm on that list, they know which database entries they'll want to know more about: "Say, this person with credit card # 123 and phone # 567... what else did he do recently? Do we know if he was in Hungary on Dec. 21st? Did he ever search for one of these keywords? ...?"
Governments wouldn't get these answers from any flashlight application (that I don't use anyway) or from a particular Ovi service that stores location info from pictures I took.
If that sounds paranoid to you because, well, there's nothing you'd have to hide and you're online profile is too mainstream to be of any interest: Yes, today. But what about tomorrow? Imagine you live in Egypt and a year ago, you'd have said: "Nothing I have to worry about, I'm a good citizen! Not only do I have no connections to the opposition, quite on the contrary, every trace I might leave online proves I'm an active supporter of Mubarak and his regime. Hey, records about me could even prove that I turned two activists of the opposition over to the secret service!" - Now. Fine. Times change. We're not so sure if this is true for your data that's stored by Google.
Last edited by benny1967; 2011-02-16 at 10:34.
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2011-02-16
, 10:25
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Posts: 1,986 |
Thanked: 7,698 times |
Joined on Dec 2010
@ Dayton, Ohio
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#47
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Originally Posted by govprog
That chart shows that OS X plus Linux makes up about ten percent of the desktop PC world. That's a heck of a lot of people using Unix, and this is counting all the machines used to browse the web, not just the ones sold recently...
I would like very much to believe it but the chart is showing something different
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2011-02-16
, 10:46
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Posts: 218 |
Thanked: 128 times |
Joined on Dec 2010
@ Abu Dhabi , UAE
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#48
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Originally Posted by benny1967
I don't know but maybe the bing is doing the same thing
The difference between a flashlight application for WP7 or Ovi on the one hand and Google on the other is the amount of data they have about me... and the way Google collects it without telling me.
Originally Posted by benny1967
That was an example. There are lots of free apps that collects your personal data in the store(Compared to the paid version.) Although government might never ask any of them for the data they had collected(or maybe the data is not critical anyway), this counts as an privacy exposure too.
Governments wouldn't get these answers from any flashlight application (that I don't use anyway) or from a particular Ovi service that stores location info from pictures I took.
Originally Posted by benny1967
In this matter you are right. This will be really annoying if someone manages to store and abuse your private data that is critical for you and or the others.
If that sounds paranoid to you because, well, there's nothing you'd have to hide and you're online profile is too mainstream to be of any interest: Yes, today. But what about tomorrow? Imagine you live in Egypt and a year ago, you'd have said: "Nothing I have to worry about, I'm a good citizen! Not only do I have no connections to the opposition, quite on the contrary, every trace I might leave online proves I'm an active supporter of Mubarak and his regime. Hey, records about me could even prove that I turned two activists of the opposition over to the secret service!" - Now. Fine. Times change. We're not so sure if this is true for your data that's stored by Google.
Originally Posted by Copernicus
The chart shows that the Linux+Mac users are less than Windows Vista users.But,let's hope the thing you said is true.
That chart shows that OS X plus Linux makes up about ten percent of the desktop PC world. That's a heck of a lot of people using Unix, and this is counting all the machines used to browse the web, not just the ones sold recently...
Last edited by govprog; 2011-02-16 at 11:44.
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2011-02-16
, 11:57
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Posts: 179 |
Thanked: 99 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
@ Yorkshire, UK
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#49
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Originally Posted by Dave999
Actually there was an article recently that pointed to opera being the worlds biggest data gatherer, and in much more detail than even opera realise. Because of the way they render web pages on their servers and send it to your phone, instead of just collecting bits, they render the whole web site.
The guy with most collected data when he dies wins! (I'm pretty sure the winner working at google)
However opera are not interested in it and don't use or even scan through it. They just provide the service.
Google however are mony grabbing scumbags. And Schmidt is insane if he thinks people will move to avoid streetview etc.
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I say: After the N900, never buying nokia.
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2011-02-16
, 12:52
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Banned |
Posts: 974 |
Thanked: 622 times |
Joined on Oct 2010
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#50
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Originally Posted by Copernicus
Well put, but WP is good. It is built from the ground up using the expertice and experience from the very succesful Windows CE and honed towards modern touch screen phones. Nokia could have done the same with Symbian, but didn't. In hindsight it is all too obvious that MS did what needed to be done and Nokia didn't.
Untrue. Many of the various Linux distributions could be considered bloatware, but the Linux kernel itself is remarkably trim, even comparing against many of the microkernel competitors that have come up against it over the years. For the variety of services it provides, Linux has held up quite well over the years, and if you want to make a really thin distribution, it is easy to do so...
The real problem, of course, is that companies don't want to distribute devices (like cellphones) with minimal, efficient operating systems; they want to deliver products jam-packed with eye candy and whizz-bang apps. There's a reason why iOS and WP7 have been avoiding multitasking; they've crammed so much unnecessary appware into their OSs, you can't really allow two processes to run without saturating the CPU. :P
WP will soon go down in HW specs, and penetrate the mid market, something MeeGo cannot do.
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All times are GMT. The time now is 13:54.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10358024-16.html
So, can you now please stop making ignorant fun of people who recognize that the kernel is bigger than what is optimal on limited resources? Powerful cross-device Linux kernel comes at a cost. We're all fine with that, or we'd be on some dumbphone community site, right?