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GeneralAntilles |
2008-01-23
, 23:59
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Posts: 5,478 |
Thanked: 5,222 times |
Joined on Jan 2006
@ St. Petersburg, FL
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#51
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Originally Posted by Hedgecore
With small consumer electronics like these? Heck yeah! Look at mp3 players, cellphones, televisions, laptops, cameras, GPS navigators, blah blah blah—the list goes on. There are tons of devices with refresh cycles of the same length. It's nothing unusual. Especially considering the cellular market that Nokia is used to where released devices are pretty much a done deal.
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2008-01-24
, 00:44
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Posts: 191 |
Thanked: 9 times |
Joined on Nov 2005
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#52
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Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles
Yes but most of those devices you mention actually work properly when they are released. The 770 was flawed when it was released and they stopped supporting it BEFORE they bothered to fix it. Upgrading in 12 months to get something better is fine. Being told in 12 months 'Oh, yeah that one you have is all broken but if you buy the next model it will be fixed' isn't.
With small consumer electronics like these? Heck yeah! Look at mp3 players, cellphones, televisions, laptops, cameras, GPS navigators, blah blah blah—the list goes on. There are tons of devices with refresh cycles of the same length. It's nothing unusual. Especially considering the cellular market that Nokia is used to where released devices are pretty much a done deal.
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2008-01-24
, 10:42
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Posts: 162 |
Thanked: 3 times |
Joined on Jun 2006
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#53
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Yeah, cellphones really are a "throwaway" market. It's pathetic to think how wasteful this industry is, but then partly it's because the consumers think the same way: phones dies, they go "YAY, we get to buy a brand-spankin' one with more bells and whistles, shop shop shop, just throw the broken one in the trash."
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2008-01-24
, 12:30
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Posts: 29 |
Thanked: 7 times |
Joined on Dec 2007
@ Greater Boston
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#54
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Don't mistake me, I'm not promoting Verizon as a charitable organization, but they DO have a box in every store to donate your old phones to battered women's shelters.
The idea is that they give the phones to women at risk and when the women decide enough is enough they can use the phones to call for help.
Over the past 10 years I've probably put 8 or 9 phones in that box (there are 4 phones on my plan).
But you're right, American culture is that once there's something shinier, what you have goes in the trash.
The idea is that they give the phones to women at risk and when the women decide enough is enough they can use the phones to call for help.
Over the past 10 years I've probably put 8 or 9 phones in that box (there are 4 phones on my plan).
But you're right, American culture is that once there's something shinier, what you have goes in the trash.
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2008-01-24
, 12:49
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Posts: 449 |
Thanked: 29 times |
Joined on Jun 2006
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#55
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Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles
With small consumer electronics like these? Heck yeah! Look at mp3 players, cellphones, televisions, laptops, cameras, GPS navigators, blah blah blah—the list goes on. There are tons of devices with refresh cycles of the same length. It's nothing unusual. Especially considering the cellular market that Nokia is used to where released devices are pretty much a done deal.
Huh??? Your logic is totally flawed, what exactly are you trying to argue? No kid that products get upgraded, but at least the previous product that was upgraded worked!
Simply put the OS on the 770 was never brought to a state that it should have been brought too in order to make the 770 a fully usable device for the masses. Instead they snubbed their noses at 770 users and told them good luck when releasing the N800. The only reason the 2007HE came out is because of user backlash and even then its called the "Hacker Edition" which really doesn't instill much confidence in the release and/or Nokia. Simply put Nokia for the most part abandon the 770 and its abandonment has nothing to do with natural product upgrades that take place; we all expect that, but at least fixed the product they had in the market place first rather then turning a blind eye!
Anyone who upgraded to the N800 from the 770 is foolish for supporting a company who doesn't support its existing customer base.
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2008-01-24
, 13:46
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Posts: 178 |
Thanked: 40 times |
Joined on Aug 2007
@ UK
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#56
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Originally Posted by Drewvt
I don't even think most wait until it dies, more like "this phone looks soooooo out of date, I *need* a new one!"
... but then partly it's because the consumers think the same way: phones dies, they go "YAY, we get to buy a brand-spankin' one with more bells and whistles, shop shop shop, just throw the broken one in the trash."
Re end-of-lined devices and waste: I think manufacturers should be legally obliged to release all information and source code on/before EOL date. There would patent problems no doubt but as e-waste (g-waste?) grows then something should be done.
Re 770, can't believe they eol'ed it so soon. It is still a very capable device and IMHO feels best in the hand out of the three (N810 comes close but is slippery). Me can't complain though as I got two at knock down price
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2008-01-24
, 15:09
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Posts: 5,478 |
Thanked: 5,222 times |
Joined on Jan 2006
@ St. Petersburg, FL
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#57
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Originally Posted by bac522
I don't agree with what Nokia did, my attempt was simply to explain the potential logic behind their moves. Besides, if you think that all the devices I mentioned are all released as well-working products, you, sir, are mistaken.
Huh??? Your logic is totally flawed, what exactly are you trying to argue? No kid that products get upgraded, but at least the previous product that was upgraded worked!
Originally Posted by bac522
Meh, I got a lot of use out of my 770s (and still do), and I get a even more use out of my N800. Personally, I'm a happy customer.
Anyone who upgraded to the N800 from the 770 is foolish for supporting a company who doesn't support its existing customer base.
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2008-01-24
, 16:22
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Posts: 98 |
Thanked: 3 times |
Joined on Nov 2007
@ Knightdale, NC
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#58
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Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles
Meh, I got a lot of use out of my 770s (and still do), and I get a even more use out of my N800. Personally, I'm a happy customer.
I think that's what the problem is. We all bought computers in the mid 90's, took them home only to find out that the computer you just bought is obsolete and now on sale. Lesson learned. Smart people are not going to fall for that behavior again. Nokia needs to release a device that they plan on standing behind. They haven't stood behind any of these devices - all they did was release a new device and tell you "ohh this one is better". How many times are you going to buy their latest device?? - everyone must upgrade at some point, but this is crazy. Look at the release dates below:
N770 - NOVEMBER 2005 (damn well 2006)
N800 - 2007
N810 - 2007
This means that while they were selling you on how great the N800 was - they were already planning to sell something better!
Does this seem like they are standing behind their products or do they just want to make sure they sell more than one to anybody who falls for "ohh this one is better". With this track record, don't be in my place next year (or later this year) when they forget about your N800. Will you then buy the N810?
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2008-01-24
, 16:35
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Posts: 449 |
Thanked: 29 times |
Joined on Jun 2006
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#59
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Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles
There is no logic behind their move. They don't look at the IT market as being viable to the core segment of their business, thus they don't care if they upset their current customer base. Then and even now I suspect the IT is nothing more then a test product to see if there are options that they can eventually incorporate into their cell phones such as using a Linux as a based OS or incorporating VoWLAN or VoIP with cellular voice. I wouldn't be surprised one bit if the N810 was the last of its product line. It clearly doesn't contribute much to the product line since, other then for a one sentence line, there wasn't any further mention in their financials as being a major contributor or significant product for the company; eventually someone at the top will kill the product off.
I don't agree with what Nokia did, my attempt was simply to explain the potential logic behind their moves
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2008-01-24
, 17:44
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Posts: 11 |
Thanked: 8 times |
Joined on Jul 2006
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#60
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Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles
Except that in your example, each new generation doesn't obsolete the prior generation when it's released. MP3 players? I still have an old Rio 500 from 1999 that will work with MP3 files ripped or sold today. Cellphones? How long has it been since a network upgrade killed old cellphones? TVs? Next year's switch to digital TVs will obsolete old ones, unless they get a converter box... but that's been the first major format obsolescence since color TV came in in the 1960's. How many of the consumer electronics devices you name above follow the specific 770 situation, where the manufacturer killed off compatibility between generations?
With small consumer electronics like these? Heck yeah! Look at mp3 players, cellphones, televisions, laptops, cameras, GPS navigators, blah blah blah—the list goes on. There are tons of devices with refresh cycles of the same length. It's nothing unusual. Especially considering the cellular market that Nokia is used to where released devices are pretty much a done deal.
Heck, how many years back does software compatibility go in the Palm lineup? I think current Palm software will run on units going at least as far back as the Tungsten T, which was a 2002 release...
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