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lemmyslender	2009-04-22 , 18:45
Posts: 968 \| Thanked: 974 times \| Joined on Nov 2008 @ Ohio	#51

Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles

Perhaps daperl is missing some technical details or I'm still not getting it. In your proposal, a working stylus keyboard has nothing at all to do with the finger keyboard.

I linked to Hildon Input Method the last time this was discussed (we just love to run around in circles around here), perhaps you should read up on it.

Despite being able to find my way to ITT, I am by no means a programer / fluent in programing languages. Nor am I by any means a linux guru.

So judging by your answer, I'm going to assume that it is not possible to do what I was suggesting.

Perhaps daperl meant something else or had different ideas.

Moving on......

Last edited by lemmyslender; 2009-04-22 at 18:50.

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	GeneralAntilles	2009-04-22 , 18:55
	Posts: 5,478 \| Thanked: 5,222 times \| Joined on Jan 2006 @ St. Petersburg, FL	#52

Originally Posted by lemmyslender

So judging by your answer, I'm going to assume that it is not possible to do what I was suggesting.

You seem to have taken the opposite conclusion to what I was trying to say in my post.

Hildon Input Method is open source and has a nice plugin architecture. It would be fairly simple for any interested party to put together their own stylus keyboard (or work from the example keyboard included with it).

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lemmyslender	2009-04-22 , 19:39
Posts: 968 \| Thanked: 974 times \| Joined on Nov 2008 @ Ohio	#53

Fair enough, we can add another keyboard. I already understood that, I don't think that's what daperl was asking though. I was thinking more along the lines of editing sytemui.xml to enable the soft power-off option.

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	daperl	2009-04-22 , 20:45
	Posts: 2,427 \| Thanked: 2,986 times \| Joined on Dec 2007	#54

Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles

Perhaps you should explain what a finger keyboard that can "act and stay like a stylus keyboard" actually means, since the paragraph I'm quoting makes zero sense.

Yeah, that was confusing. lemmyslender did a good job of explaining what I meant. But if you thought that didn't make sense, it only gets worse if you read further.

By "act and stay" I meant if the finger keyboard is configurable enough, it might be possible to mimic the stylus keyboard.

Sure, I could port the example keyboard. I can do lots of things. Good for me. But that's far from the point. Nokia is making me work harder than I think I should have to. I've been trying to "Nokia Proof" myself for almost a year now, but I'll admit, the "removal of stylus keyboard" was a bigger than normal shock. Ain't no thang; I'll just lower my Nokia bar and move on.

Currently, my Fremantle/RX-51 motivation is low; I have 2 very well-oiled Diablo machines that are kicking a*s, and I make them better every day (thank you Bundyo and jmalonzo). I'm not jonesing for new $500 hardware as much as some others are. And I'm certainly not jonesing for hardware and software that make me do back flips.

We all know talk is cheap, but Nokia has given us plenty of idle time to do nothing but. If I seem impatient or overly frustated, my mistake. I'm not. In general I could care less, but I do enjoy discussing these things. <flamebait>In my opinion, Nokia represents themselves way too defensively on this forum. There's only been one Nokian who was also a properly dissenting community member, and...</flamebait>

Can't wait for the Beta!

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TheTree	2009-04-22 , 22:25
Posts: 68 \| Thanked: 63 times \| Joined on Sep 2008	#55

Originally Posted by glabifrons

Before anyone goes off on "but it's not confirmed", my response is directed to the below quoted comments.

I am of the exact opposite opinion.
I find using the finger interface imprecise and awkward... I'd much rather use the stylus.

While I don't have sausage-fingers, my fingers are no-where near dainty enough to be able to even unlock the screen on the 1st try (ever). I almost have to use the stylus for that.

Also, my fingers are MUCH bigger than the stylus... I can't imagine playing any games with my finger blocking 10%+ of the screen.
How could you possibly play any tablet-oriented games like breakout or Numpty-Physics with your finger? (even the stylus isn't precise enough sometimes)

And you even mentioned web browsing... perfect example.
THIS SITE's front page is impossible to navigate with fingers even when zoomed! The stylus is barely precise enough to click the posting links from the front page.

Do you seriously use your fingers _only_ on the tablet? (or was this just a troll?)

One of the biggest reasons why it's so difficult to use your finger to navigate web links is the resistive touch screen. Resistive touch screens are crap when used with a finger. I have both a N810 and an iPod touch and when selecting, for example, "page 5" on a thread on ITT, I can use the capacitive screen on the iPod with a finger about as accurately as the stylus on the N810, without zooming way in on either device.

I will be quite disappointed if Nokia decides to drop the stylus but keep a resistive screen as that would just about kill the usability of the device even with an overhauled UI. They either need to keep the stylus (which, given some of the arguments given, I believe they will), or switch to projection capacitive.

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	GeneralAntilles	2009-04-22 , 22:39
	Posts: 5,478 \| Thanked: 5,222 times \| Joined on Jan 2006 @ St. Petersburg, FL	#56

Originally Posted by daperl

<flamebait>In my opinion, Nokia represents themselves way too defensively on this forum. There's only been one Nokian who was also a properly dissenting community member, and...</flamebait>

I shouldn't respond to flamebait, and there's a lot wrong with this statement that I don't have the energy to address, but I just can't let this one fly totally unanswered, so, I'll propose a situation for you:

If every time you walked through a door, somebody slapped you in the face. You'd start to flinch when you walked through doors, wouldn't you?*

*To clarify, the only people who are to blame for anybody being defensive are the people who always insist on attacking. <rant>Sometimes it amazes me that we have any Nokians here at all considering the amount of bile people like to spew around. To the people who complain (entirely unfoundedly, I might add) about Nokia not being involved enough, stop and think about how long you'd stick around if a half-dozen people jumped down your throat about decisions your employer made every time you stuck your head in the door.</rant>

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Last edited by GeneralAntilles; 2009-04-22 at 22:40. Reason: Closing italics

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	GeneralAntilles	2009-04-22 , 22:44
	Posts: 5,478 \| Thanked: 5,222 times \| Joined on Jan 2006 @ St. Petersburg, FL	#57

Originally Posted by TheTree

One of the biggest reasons why it's so difficult to use your finger to navigate web links is the resistive touch screen. Resistive touch screens are crap when used with a finger. I have both a N810 and an iPod touch and when selecting, for example, "page 5" on a thread on ITT, I can use the capacitive screen on the iPod with a finger about as accurately as the stylus on the N810, without zooming way in on either device.

Sorry, no, but it's much more complicated than that. There are two big reasons that have nothing to do with the touchscreen technology used:

First, uses fuzzy click-detection logic. If you don't hit the link perfectly it will guess that the link is what you were shooting for.

Second, the iPod has a lower PPI screen, so links on the iPod are bigger and easier to hit simply because it backs fewer pixels into the same amount of space.

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	daperl	2009-04-23 , 01:09
	Posts: 2,427 \| Thanked: 2,986 times \| Joined on Dec 2007	#58

Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles

If every time you walked through a door, somebody slapped you in the face. You'd start to flinch when you walked through doors, wouldn't you?

Your analogy is a little dramatic, even for me. I worked for AOL before, during and after their purchase of Netscape and Time Warner. You think I gave a sh*t about people being critical? But if there was a problem with something I was directly responsible for I was all over it. "My customer is always right." Or did I just make that up? Your life lesson is over.

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	GeneralAntilles	2009-04-23 , 01:20
	Posts: 5,478 \| Thanked: 5,222 times \| Joined on Jan 2006 @ St. Petersburg, FL	#59

Originally Posted by daperl

You think I gave a sh*t about people being critical?

There's a fine line between critical and abusive, and people here cross it far too often.

Originally Posted by daperl

But if there was a problem with something I was directly responsible for I was all over it. "My customer is always right." Or did I just make that up?

"The customer is always right" doesn't actually mean "the customer is always right". It doesn't mean every idiot with an opinion should be in charge of product design.

Originally Posted by daperl