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lma is offline lma
2010-12-07 , 23:24
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#61
Originally Posted by fpp View Post
Only newcomers may claim surprise though, as it's always been that way since the 770 in 2005, four devices gone to waste already.
To be fair, they did say they learned from the 770 story and for a while it looked like they did: the N800 got Bora, Chinook and Diablo, and potentially Elephanta down the line. Then the iPhone happened, Elephanta was scrapped, we had a 2-year gap between devices/OS releases and when it finally arrived it had lost half of what made Maemo unique.

(Yes, it's my standing position to blame Apple for everything, why do you ask?)
 

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lma is offline lma
2010-12-07 , 23:33
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#62
Originally Posted by Jaffa View Post
And Nokia's apps will (almost certainly) be closed source.
I sincerely hope and expect the email client at least to be open.

So to get those working requires a level of ABI compatibility
Hm, do we know if Harmattan is still softfp?

Open MeeGo running (some) Harmattan apps might be doable - but I'm struggling to believe it'll be a polished experience, to be honest; and what if Harmattan's apps/SSU repo requires a valid Harmattan device IMEI?
There's a big spanner in the works here: platform security. Open MeeGo won't have access to the TPM chip (unless we can convince Nokia to sign our kernels every time, extremely doubtful IMHO), and even if Nokia gives us .debs that will install most of the apps will need platsec to protect user data etc so won't work.
 

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SD69 is offline SD69
2010-12-07 , 23:45
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#63
Originally Posted by lma View Post
Nine actually, your query didn't include ones with ASSIGNED status (one of which happens to be the #1 by votes in the bugjar) :-)
And let's not forget the "WONT FIX" list

https://bugs.maemo.org/buglist.cgi?q...ial%20Platform
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nicolai is offline nicolai
2010-12-07 , 23:59
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#64
Originally Posted by qgil View Post
Also let me remind you that there are only five items currently open in the licensing change requests queue. The rest was discussed, explained and resolved a long ago. You can analyze the impact these open requests have over the Maemo/N900 user base.
I would make more requests, but sadly they are all related to nokias closed applications.
(Calendar, Conversations, Mediaplayer (- applet)...
And if I understand you right, Nokia will never open this applications.
This "ideas open various parts ...." gave me the hope there is something new.
So, if it is worthwhile I can file licensing change requests.

Nicolai
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MohammadAG is offline MohammadAG
2010-12-08 , 02:26
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#65
Originally Posted by nicolai View Post
I would make more requests, but sadly they are all related to nokias closed applications.
(Calendar, Conversations, Mediaplayer (- applet)...
And if I understand you right, Nokia will never open this applications.
This "ideas open various parts ...." gave me the hope there is something new.
So, if it is worthwhile I can file licensing change requests.

Nicolai
The way I see it, the best thing right now would be a rewrite of the stock apps, it takes time, but it's the only way go FOSS here :/

Here's a start (in Qt), hopefully, this project won't die, I'll open a gitorious page soon (it's currently a UI only) :|


 

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stenny is offline stenny
2010-12-08 , 03:09
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#66
Originally Posted by Jaffa View Post
Yeah; and - no disrespect to Graham & GPE - it took Fremantle's (closed source) calendar for us to have a calendar I wanted to use on a daily basis on Maemo. That took 4 years and ended up with Nokia having to do it.
That's all well and good, but the calendar nokia made uses some ridiculous one-off backend, can't sync to anything at all reliably, has a completely useless tasks/notes setup, and has several (already mentioned) bugs rendering it nearly useless to a serious user.

Fine, you say, write a better one. That is a bad response, since the bugs the current calendar suffers are all fixable if they'd just open-source the damn thing. There is literally no possible business advantage nokia can be getting out of keeping it locked down. Instead of nicely integrating caldav into the existing calendar, I'm having to kludge a whole series of packages that try to work alongside this thing and work around its stupid timezone bugs.

I'd even prefer a non-redistributable license as long as I could see the source at all so I don't have to spend hours reverse-engineering bugs just to isolate problems that shouldn't exist.
 

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Jaffa is offline Jaffa
2010-12-08 , 09:21
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#67
Originally Posted by lma View Post
Hm, do we know if Harmattan is still softfp?
I know there are various discussions on meego-dev about softfp vs. hardfp and switching to hardfp for MeeGo 1.2. One of the reasons is Harmattan and Linaro alignment, I believe (with the big overriding one being performance).

More detail in the TSG meeting log for the proposal; and the ToolchainChangeProposal itself.

Stskeeps is the man in the know, though. EDIT: and he points us at this email which pretty much states Harmattan is hardfp.
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Last edited by Jaffa; 2010-12-08 at 09:23. Reason: Confirmation
 

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SD69 is offline SD69
2010-12-08 , 13:23
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#68
Originally Posted by stenny View Post

I'd even prefer a non-redistributable license as long as I could see the source at all so I don't have to spend hours reverse-engineering bugs just to isolate problems that shouldn't exist.
Hmm. Perhaps we should think of alternative ways to get past this roadblock beside completely opening. Maybe Nokia could give maemo.org a restricted license so a limited number of "trusted" people could access and modify the source under limitations sufficient to "protect" Nokia's interests and then maemo.org could redistribute the modified binaries to the public?
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Jaffa is offline Jaffa
2010-12-08 , 13:35
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#69
Originally Posted by SD69 View Post
Hmm. Perhaps we should think of alternative ways to get past this roadblock beside completely opening. Maybe Nokia could give maemo.org a restricted license so a limited number of "trusted" people could access and modify the source under limitations sufficient to "protect" Nokia's interests and then maemo.org could redistribute the modified binaries to the public?
A similar thing was suggested for PowerVR drivers etc. Nokia had issues with the financial liability that could be incurred by one or more individuals against whom they'd have no recourse.
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SD69 is offline SD69
2010-12-08 , 14:09
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#70
Originally Posted by Jaffa View Post
A similar thing was suggested for PowerVR drivers etc. Nokia had issues with the financial liability that could be incurred by one or more individuals against whom they'd have no recourse.
That can be addressed. Yes, the terms of the 3rd party license have to be honored, but if there is a will, there most likely is a way to do this (not complete open source unfortunately, but a license that permits redistribution of modified binaries).
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