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2009-07-07
, 12:49
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Posts: 5,335 |
Thanked: 8,187 times |
Joined on Mar 2007
@ Pennsylvania, USA
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#72
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Originally Posted by richie
I wonder if Nokia WRT might be significantly expanded, enhanced and brought to Maemo by the time Harmattan becomes a serious application development target.
Does this mean 'runtimes' are the easiest route in Harmattan?
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2009-07-07
, 13:04
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Posts: 341 |
Thanked: 64 times |
Joined on May 2009
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#73
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Originally Posted by lma
skype for one, always has been a native QT app as far as i know.
Uhmm... you are ignoring all the Nokia userland stuff. They will have to rewrite every single hildon user-space app/applet in C++/Qt. That includes the file manager, media player, image viewer, pdf reader, rss reader, calculator, clock, sketch, terminal, application manager, backup/restore, connection manager, internet call, chat, contacts, modest, microb, control panel, statusbar and desktop applets, the whole shebang.
Additionally, all the "partner" applications will have to be rewritten as well: skype, gizmo, wayfinder etc. I'm guessing the Mozilla (fennec, not microb) people may not be too happy to switch to Qt either.
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2009-07-07
, 13:08
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Posts: 2,802 |
Thanked: 4,491 times |
Joined on Nov 2007
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#74
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Originally Posted by vivainio
Yes, but given the magnitude of the task and the repeatedly cited lack of resources it's going to be a rush job. How many features (or entire apps) will be dropped? How many new bugs will be introduced? How many Fremantle "Official Applications" bugs are likely to be even looked at?
Luckily, Nokia will be footing the bill for those.
Until last week we were given to understand that both frameworks would eventually coexist, so there would be no need to throw away the baby with the bathwater. Even if Hildon absolutely positively must be dropped, a sane transition plan (ie one release with both present and supported) wouldn't necessitate would give more time to everyone to move over gracefully. The current plan is really a bonehead maneuver - not even Apple does things like this!
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2009-07-07
, 13:28
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Posts: 2,802 |
Thanked: 4,491 times |
Joined on Nov 2007
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#75
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Originally Posted by REMFwhoopitydo
Is it? Dunno, I never installed it :-) The point still stands though, there are all sorts of "non-free" applications whose authors might not be willing to rewrite from scratch in a different language.
skype for one, always has been a native QT app as far as i know.
A related issue is ports of existing upstream apps (which for obvious reasons are extremely unlikely to even consider switching). Goodbye Pidgin, Gpodder, Abiword, Gnumeric and so on unless/until "the community" manages to port Hildon to Harmattan. Anidel has already indicated that we'll lose Xournal, and I can't blame him.
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2009-07-07
, 13:29
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Posts: 3,319 |
Thanked: 5,610 times |
Joined on Aug 2008
@ Finland
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#76
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Originally Posted by lma
What do you mean, more time ? We're talking about things so much in the feature that even the year is an estimate and releases that follow stuff that itself is so new that has not been released yet... Also, Fremantle IS the transitional release you are missing - it seems it will have solid Qt support even though the default toolkit is GTK. The Qt maneuver was pretty certain once Nokia bought Qt (from that point on, it would have been silly NOT to push Qt). Whether that will cause the 5 step program to become a 6 step, we have yet to see (e.g. will Harmattan manage to nail Qt first time on and be the real deal, or will there be an additional release that will finalize Maemo incubation for the general public).
Even if Hildon absolutely positively must be dropped, a sane transition plan (ie one release with both present and supported) wouldn't necessitate would give more time to everyone to move over gracefully.
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2009-07-07
, 13:30
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Posts: 415 |
Thanked: 182 times |
Joined on Nov 2007
@ Leeds UK
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#77
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Given the current roadmap just specifies "after Fremantle" and given that hasn't even been given an official release date yet, aren't we all jumping the gun a little?
My assumption would be that Fremantle is there to allow both frameworks to co-exist and start the migration of "non-official" apps to Qt and then Harmatten will be the migration of "official" apps?
If it's any slower aren't we likely to be on QT 6 ? ;-)
My assumption would be that Fremantle is there to allow both frameworks to co-exist and start the migration of "non-official" apps to Qt and then Harmatten will be the migration of "official" apps?
If it's any slower aren't we likely to be on QT 6 ? ;-)
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2009-07-07
, 13:31
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Posts: 2,355 |
Thanked: 5,249 times |
Joined on Jan 2009
@ Barcelona
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#78
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Indeed. While I personally applaud the QT switch, this is two API breaks we're talking about (both of them within a few years span).
BTW, I believe this has not been posted here yet:
http://live.gnome.org/GObjectIntrosp...GObjectConsume
I like the way it sounds. Maybe Nokia is using something like that? AFAIK they're going to continue using glib, so it may make sense. Who knows.
BTW, I believe this has not been posted here yet:
http://live.gnome.org/GObjectIntrosp...GObjectConsume
I like the way it sounds. Maybe Nokia is using something like that? AFAIK they're going to continue using glib, so it may make sense. Who knows.
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2009-07-07
, 13:43
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Posts: 2,802 |
Thanked: 4,491 times |
Joined on Nov 2007
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#79
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Originally Posted by attila77
Not having to rewrite the world all at once in a hurry.
What do you mean, more time ?
Also, Fremantle IS the transitional release you are missing - it seems it will have solid Qt support even though the default toolkit is GTK.
- Fremantle: Nokia-supported Hildon / community-supported Qt.
- Harmattan: Nokia-supported Qt / community-supported (maybe) Hildon
I don't see a smooth transition at any point. That may work for a hobbyist project, but commercial software developers will laugh at your face if shown such a roadmap. At best they will completely skip Fremantle and wait and see if Harmattan piques their interest.
The Qt maneuver was pretty certain once Nokia bought Qt (from that point on, it would have been silly NOT to push Qt).
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2009-07-07
, 13:48
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Posts: 1,097 |
Thanked: 650 times |
Joined on Nov 2007
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#80
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If the Qt route means that both Symbian as an application platform and Maemo as a application platform support a common language QT - then that is a boon - in the sence apps written for one platform can be easily ported to symbian platform with much more minor changes.
The cross-platform nature in the mobile sphere itself is a huge boon. Name one language now in the mobile world where you can develop an application and make it work on another mobile platform ? NONE.
(Of course not counting Java)
So this move seems more enticing from a developer perspective.
And getting a developer momentum is I believe the most critical thing in establishing a mobile platform as a standard.
Look where Zaurus (with its Qtopia), OpenMoko and Moto Linux got to without a big developer community behind it.
Even Maemo developer community is a niche community we have to agree.
So any effort to encompass a bigger development world is worth a try I believe.
The cross-platform nature in the mobile sphere itself is a huge boon. Name one language now in the mobile world where you can develop an application and make it work on another mobile platform ? NONE.
(Of course not counting Java)
So this move seems more enticing from a developer perspective.
And getting a developer momentum is I believe the most critical thing in establishing a mobile platform as a standard.
Look where Zaurus (with its Qtopia), OpenMoko and Moto Linux got to without a big developer community behind it.
Even Maemo developer community is a niche community we have to agree.
So any effort to encompass a bigger development world is worth a try I believe.
Ryan Abel