So, you wrote a letter to Nokia that was.... errrm... what? =)

Ohmm..This is embarrassing....just click this area and read that thread (should probably be sticky). There was also news input a while a go in news section.

Acted on. Did you get to my second paragraph where I gave you the names of two Nokians (one community manager, one developer advocate) who are working internally on getting answers from the Ovi people?

Do developers need advocates these days?

Language tidbit - the slavic use of that word is different, as it (advokat, adwokat, адвокат) has a primarily legal, formal representative conotation. In English this is much less so, especially in cases like this - it simply means "argue for/in favor of", essentially the link between the actual developers and those who make the tools.

The role of the MeeGo Developer Advocate, AIUI, is to address developer concerns and act as a liaison (e.g. documentation site etc) but - primarily - to advocate development on the platform. Hopefully the former eases the path for the latter.

I appreciate what Texrat, Jaffa and the council members (don't remember the full five) are trying to do.

But in all seriousness if the councils actions havent produced much results (lets face it - most here dont even know a council exists cause theres nothing to show for it), then the question of the councils effectiveness is valid. And this is not to say you guys are not trying. But if the repeated efforts produce very little to no results than is obvious the council's work is ineffective (it may be because Nokia themselves dont care about feedback from the community via the council).

Rather then people blaming and finger pointing at the council - cause I dont think its the ineffectiveness of the council members individually, rather a shortcoming of this setup itself - how about the council memebers evaluate your effectiveness yourselves in all earnest, and if you deem like the majority here that not much HAS been achived and not much CAN be achieved vis-a-vis the interactions with Nokia, the council reasigns en-masse.

I think Nokia is the entitiy stonewalling the community efforts now so a mass resignation will give a much stronger united message to Nokia that this ineffectual council setup isnt working and hence its pointless.

And if you think that working from within is still worth the effort, then make such efforts and the results more transparent so its not questioned in the first place. Eiither ways make a change in this slatemated process as I see it.

Yes, I did. But, it didn't imply there has been any answer from Ovi people so far, did it?

As my colleagues have already said, one of the council's big roles is facilitation, which is not a high-profile job that you're going to hear a lot about or see obvious results of. So, no, I don't think there's an issue with many people not seeing a lot of what the council does, and trying to make that into an issue is silly.

Just a Question about the ignorance from Nokia arent there any contracts between Maemo as Product and Nokia? I mean did the whole greate Community here put all the Work on Maemo5 without any contract or something like that?

Maybe the guys at this Forum could understand more the work of the Council if they would know about what they worked out with Nokia in the past too.