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| The Following 11 Users Say Thank You to Texrat For This Useful Post: | ||
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2012-04-06
, 05:26
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Posts: 1,096 |
Thanked: 760 times |
Joined on Dec 2008
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#792
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yes, we all wanted the council to be the small local cadre who marched up to the big corporation and demanded to be heard, but really they are like the soldiers who come to your door:
"i am sorry to inform you on behalf of the president, your son has been killed in action by an oddly named wind"
the council is dead already or should be killed, or maybe they can bargain for the dead horse's tail and mane hair.
thanks to all who served, befuddlement to those who enlist now.
Last edited by quipper8; 2012-04-06 at 05:30.
"i am sorry to inform you on behalf of the president, your son has been killed in action by an oddly named wind"
the council is dead already or should be killed, or maybe they can bargain for the dead horse's tail and mane hair.
thanks to all who served, befuddlement to those who enlist now.
Last edited by quipper8; 2012-04-06 at 05:30.
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2012-04-06
, 07:27
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Posts: 1,625 |
Thanked: 998 times |
Joined on Aug 2010
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#793
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Originally Posted by Texrat
thanks for the (historical) perspective
[...] If only.
Originally Posted by Texrat
to develop on [...], maybe it is important to remember another thing; until a few years ago, NOKIA was selling devices like donuts with coffee in the morning... ppl just bought it without even thinking about it (at least in ROW
Anyway I do understand the current confusion. With no active products, and the OS' future essentially shrouded in mystery, what is there to represent? Note that I ask that rhetorically, not as a challenge. I am interested though in everyone's honest answer to that question.
)days when a mobile phone was simply called a nokia in some parts of the world...
it was easy to support a hopelessly unprofitable project like Maemo back then...
in today’s situation, independently of the (management) choices made to address it, this is a whole different ballgame...
still, there seems to be more MeeGo / Harmattan devices coming and so far, i haven't seen anyone providing a concrete piece of info that NOKIA is not going to renew its founding...
i think Rob (SD69) (?) even mentioned that NOKIA would like to include Harmattan better in Maemo.org
that doesn't sound like "no future" to me
to keep in mind before taking any rash decisions, maybe?
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2012-04-06
, 12:38
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Posts: 1,513 |
Thanked: 2,248 times |
Joined on Mar 2006
@ US
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#794
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Originally Posted by misterc
Well, Nokia let go of Qt, in the sense that it is now a FOSS project, and it seems that all parties are happy with the situation and no "scission"(?) of the community occurred. So why can't something like that happen with maemo? The way it is now doesn't have to be the way it always is.
i'm not telling you to leave, but NOKIA is not going to let go of Maemo. if you don't like this idea and would rather create a FOSS project, you will either have to start more or less from scratch or indeed cause a scission of the community
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2012-04-06
, 19:33
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Posts: 5,028 |
Thanked: 8,613 times |
Joined on Mar 2011
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#795
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Originally Posted by Texrat
In a nutshell, an at-large elected council body of 5 people made it easier for Nokia to interface with the community. When the times called for it, 5 NDAs instead of thousands.
There's value in that alone.
Some of us, self included, tried to stretch into stronger roles of advocacy. In hindsight maybe not the best idea, since it led to misunderstandings among some here over what the council mandate actually was. "Oh, we picked you guys to make Nokia fix things!" Well... no... there was just a faint hope by some of us that a community representation role got us greater cache with Nokia. "Ah, you're maemo.org council. Sure, we'll listen to your concern about micro usb connectors falling out of N900s!" If only.
Anyway I do understand the current confusion. With no active products, and the OS' future essentially shrouded in mystery, what is there to represent? Note that I ask that rhetorically, not as a challenge. I am interested though in everyone's honest answer to that question.
Originally Posted by SD69
Totally agree with both of You. that is why I see Council not only as volunteers to represent community to Nokia, but as volunteers to represent Community for other projects too (it's already happening - see meeting about OBS, where others projects, like Mer, are involved), and as force that eases collaboration within community itself - allowing to, for example, create independent (from companies) Community.
Well, Nokia let go of Qt, in the sense that it is now a FOSS project, and it seems that all parties are happy with the situation and no "scission"(?) of the community occurred. So why can't something like that happen with maemo? The way it is now doesn't have to be the way it always is.
It it's going to be called Maemo or not is a less important thing - yet, of course, passing those things to Community as it was with QT seems reasonable and profitable for all parties involved.
/Estel
__________________
N900's aluminum backcover / body replacement
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N900's HDMI-Out
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Camera cover MOD
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Measure battery's real capacity on-device
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TrueCrypt 7.1 | ereswap | bnf
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N900's aluminum backcover / body replacement
-
N900's HDMI-Out
-
Camera cover MOD
-
Measure battery's real capacity on-device
-
TrueCrypt 7.1 | ereswap | bnf
-
Hardware's mods research is costly. To support my work, please consider donating. Thank You!
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2012-04-06
, 20:21
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Posts: 415 |
Thanked: 732 times |
Joined on Jan 2009
@ Finland
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#796
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Originally Posted by Estel
I am not saying that the council's meaning, tasks, etc. has somehow changed - I was saying that IMO there are things that the council won't most likely bump into thus "not relevant" (at this time). They could but I'm a bit pessimistic about for example about us (the community) being able to hire new staff any time soon.
Wait. you're telling us, that some thing from wiki page aren't relevant anymore, cause Nokia changed it (i.e. "hiring personel to manage maemo.org") without asking anyone, yet, Council can't change anything even via referendum?
Sorry, I'm not buying that. Trying to arbitrary reduce Council from Community representatives to "walking telegrams" is just pushing Communtiy further into forking ideas. Unless I misunderstood what You're trying to say.
I don't get the "Nokia changed it" -part. btw, I somehow got the impression that some people think I'm somehow affiliated with Nokia. Dunno if I got that wrong but in any case I'm not.
| The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to timoph For This Useful Post: | ||
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2012-04-06
, 20:43
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Posts: 2,076 |
Thanked: 3,268 times |
Joined on Feb 2011
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#797
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Originally Posted by Estel
Is CSSU clean device then? Autobuilder build of DCSS will run on CSSU device, but enter will not work. Built on CSSU device it will work on CSSU device, but not on 'clean'. Would OBS be able to address this? (this is also the case with VFU and recently same thing happened in audiophile thread with one of the proposed solutions, guaranteed to pop up again and again)
Autobuilder makes sure, that program will run even on "clean" device, i.e. without any fancy things/tools/whatever, that developers tend to have installed in their dev enviroment/devices/chain
Yet, if there is better way to ensure that, why not?
/Estel
| The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to szopin For This Useful Post: | ||
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2012-04-07
, 02:03
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Posts: 2,355 |
Thanked: 5,249 times |
Joined on Jan 2009
@ Barcelona
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#798
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Originally Posted by qwazix
(That is called sbdmock, and it is what the autobuilder uses. Not a breeze to setup, though)
The other method is to use clean RDA devices, or have a script to create a clean scratchbox environment for testing.
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2012-04-07
, 07:48
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Posts: 1,625 |
Thanked: 998 times |
Joined on Aug 2010
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#799
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Originally Posted by SD69
i'm not saying it is impossible, i'm just saying NOKIA is not going to let go of Maemo.
Well, Nokia let go of Qt, in the sense that it is now a FOSS project, and it seems that all parties are happy with the situation and no "scission"(?) of the community occurred. So why can't something like that happen with maemo? The way it is now doesn't have to be the way it always is.
or do you have confirmation to the contrary?
NOKIA doesn't need to pay for Qt
in fact, making it FOSS (considering it is the foundation of KDE) allowed 'em to cut back the expenses while being assured it would live on on its own
Maemo? life of its own?
i know, i know, that's what the next Council will have to look into, still...
who on earth would be interested in Maemo, except NOKIA?
we?
anyone?
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2012-04-07
, 17:21
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Posts: 1,513 |
Thanked: 2,248 times |
Joined on Mar 2006
@ US
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#800
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Originally Posted by misterc
There's a couple of false assumptions here. Being FOSS doesn't mean being on its own. Nokia can continue to support maemo as a FOSS project. It may even be better because there are people within Nokia who want to kill maemo/meego/linux and getting some of it out of Nokia might be the best way to let it grow. There are ample precedents for companies using FOSS, and here the chance of someone using some derivative of maemo from FOSS is definitely higher than them using Nokia's maemo. Of course, there are other advantages I will not go into.
NOKIA doesn't need to pay for Qt
in fact, making it FOSS (considering it is the foundation of KDE) allowed 'em to cut back the expenses while being assured it would live on on its own
Maemo? life of its own?
i know, i know, that's what the next Council will have to look into, still...
who on earth would be interested in Maemo, except NOKIA?
we?
anyone?
I'm not saying FOSS is the best solution, just pointing out that it's not a binary black/white decision - there are shades of gray and should not be precluded as a possibility because of the few things mentioned.
| The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to SD69 For This Useful Post: | ||
There's value in that alone.
Some of us, self included, tried to stretch into stronger roles of advocacy. In hindsight maybe not the best idea, since it led to misunderstandings among some here over what the council mandate actually was. "Oh, we picked you guys to make Nokia fix things!" Well... no... there was just a faint hope by some of us that a community representation role got us greater cache with Nokia. "Ah, you're maemo.org council. Sure, we'll listen to your concern about micro usb connectors falling out of N900s!" If only.
Anyway I do understand the current confusion. With no active products, and the OS' future essentially shrouded in mystery, what is there to represent? Note that I ask that rhetorically, not as a challenge. I am interested though in everyone's honest answer to that question.
Nokia Developer Champion
Different <> Wrong | Listen - Judgment = Progress | People + Trust = Success
My personal site: http://texrat.net