Originally Posted by ysss

@danramos: Ok, where in my post did i mention that non-replaceable battery would be cheaper? Your assumption of 'your much more expensive proprietary battery' didn't make sense either, since:
a). All laptops come with proprietary battery anyway.
b). AFAIK you haven't got the data to back up the price claim. Please calculate price\watt\lifetime also when you're doing the calculation. Don't make a mistake of calling a $179 battery that is rated for 1000 cycles (@7 hours per cycle) to be more expensive than a $60 battery that is rated for 300 cycle (@5 hours per cycle)

Hmmm... actually it seems that you've shifted your whole argument to 'open' vs proprietary standards somehow. Moreover, we were talking about the added cost of implementing modularization, not about the basic and obvious merit of having something designed modularly..

@daperl: humm.. don't you think the book is very biased, considering it's written by a *ahem* human?

NorhTec says that while the device may also be configured with lithium-ion battery packs -- which can extend battery life by up to 50 percent -- the use of AA batteries provides a substantial cost savings. In quantity, eight NiMH batteries may be sourced for approximately $10 per device, the company says, in contrast to proprietary li-ion batteries that can cost up to $100 per pack. (In addition, in many poor, remote, or rural areas of the world, AA's are the only battery to be consistently found.)

Originally Posted by Texrat

It doesn't argue that I'm wrong at all, based on a key word of yours (look for the context in my post). I highlighted it for you.

As for the remark about humans being proof of future proofing, piffle.

Originally Posted by danramos

My biggest beef with Nokia's relationship with customers is the end user provision of accessories and parts (stylus, kickstands, screens, etc. the things that people might in fact want to fix or replace easily themselves and not have to wait an ambiguous month or more for the unit to be repaired and shipped back). I've never had such terrible experiences as whenever my Nokia products (not just my N800) needed repair. As you well put it, communication with customers is another issue. Despite all the religiously faithful optimism bandied about by some of the Nokia faithful, I can't say that I feel like Nokia listens when people have problems or want something. Ever since purchasing my N800 the day they were release, I've yet to see Nokia produce anything tangible as a result of various criticisms. (The exception being the open-sourcing of the drivers for some of chipsets. I've yet to see Nokia even open-source their very own applications written for Maemo, which makes me wonder whether the credit really goes to Nokia or to these chipset manufacturers).

Sure! Call me cynical. I'm just looking at the tangible results and the experiences of my own and of those around me. I can see why people are still buying some other brand's products, trying to find that brand to be faithful to. Nokia has potential and they were at the FRONT of something great with the tablets but I sense many possibly arrogant and myopic decisions from executives that 'know better' than their own engineers and the voices of their own customers.

Let's see if they can't manage to wrangle back customers like a proper company.

Originally Posted by daperl

This was your first sentence in that paragraph:

[snip]

Originally Posted by Texrat

daperl. You can't just hone in on the first sentence to the exclusion of all else-- it wasn't the most important portion. You are willfully excluding critical context just to argue it seems.

I already highlighted the word that was germane, sooo... why the axle wrap?



I don't see how anyone can argue that if our environment changed to be hostile to man's continued existence, another species more appropriate to the new condictions couldn't fill the vacuum. In fact, I'm betting Richard Dawkins would be right on board with that.

Originally Posted by Paxicide

I have had good experiences with Nokia customer service as related to NIT repairs. However, many good experiences go unreported as they are not too much fun to learn about.

Originally Posted by daperl

Sorry, I wasn't trying to cherry pick or axle wrap(?), nor was I arguing just to argue, but when talking about life forms in regards to "future proof" or evolution, isn't it fair to assume the concept of environment is implied? Didn't I use that word in my last response?

Originally Posted by Texrat

Right, which is exactly why I was confused!

And while the concept of environment may well be implied in any such treatment, there's always he question of "how much". Every animal has its niche and tolerance ranges. If we're pushed too far out of ours, yet a potential competitor still finds room to survive or even thrive, then we will have to move aside and call it quits whether we like it or not. And our sociosuicidal tendencies seem to be pushing for just such a scenario.

But now we're getting VERY off topic...

Originally Posted by danramos

You could argue that it's all anecdotal, too, but I could say the same about these positive experiences you had and are sure most people have had. It's great that you had good experiences and that you have faith that many more people had such positive outcomes. Those positive experiences you had are cold comfort when I, my sister (she has an N800), my coworkers and other people I know have a damaged product and no support, replacement parts and insulting offers of discounts on the MUCH more expensive MSRP (even WITH that discount, ends up being MUCH more than originally paid). I just don't see how (in the grand Sigma 6 picture, here) this provides comfort to me or the folks that rant about it with me here in person and on these forums.

Originally Posted by Texrat

Well, let's differentiate here.

In the grand scheme, I can assure you field defects were a small percentage of the whole (at least up until early 2007). And the point about noncomplainers is valid, as I've described here before: happy customers don't fill up threads created for customer service venting.

That said, the issue here is what happened when that small percentage of issues were introduced to customer support. That's where the breakdown began.