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| The Following User Says Thank You to ovjo12 For This Useful Post: | ||
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2009-10-18
, 15:56
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Posts: 1,418 |
Thanked: 1,541 times |
Joined on Feb 2008
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#82
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Originally Posted by ovjo12
Then, personally, I do not see any reason to support these. The only reason to support any kind of Java is to get access to existing library of applications.
Not many I think, not so many phones support eRCP yet.
No phone from Nokia support eRCP, but eSWT is supported in all Nokia S60 phones from version 3.2.
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2009-10-18
, 15:57
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Posts: 850 |
Thanked: 626 times |
Joined on Sep 2009
@ Vienna, Austria
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#83
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Originally Posted by ovjo12
thank you for the link, but that posting is not about a MIDP 3.0 runtime. he just mentions that they would have to make revisions to their implementation once it comes out.
MIDP 3.0 is in Proposed Final Draft, so there is no JavaME VM with support yet. Read more here: http://jcp.org/aboutJava/communitypr...271/index.html
Originally Posted by fms
yes, i think this is a nokia employee. his picture, title and activity suggest that.
Is the guy who has made this statement working for Nokia?
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2009-10-18
, 18:51
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Posts: 3,397 |
Thanked: 1,212 times |
Joined on Jul 2008
@ Netherlands
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#84
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Originally Posted by SubCore
He is, he also has account here on t.m.o btw.
yes, i think this is a nokia employee. his picture, title and activity suggest that.
Originally Posted by fms
Yes, I realize that, which is why I wrote its in _SUN's_ interest.
Who, other then SUN, even needs JavaFX? Are there any useful JavaFX applications? Will there ever be any? As far as I can tell, the world seems to have standardized on Flash for these purposes.
It is, IMO, in our interest because:
1) We'd get Java ME and/or Java SE.
2) We get a more competitor to Adobe Flash and Microsoft Silverlight which is more open.
As Java hater I suppose one would see point #1 as negative.
As of now, more interesting is compatibility layer for Android, or even iPhone OS. I don't mean to run complete Android OS, but to run an application which is unique to Android without replacement/alternative/port on Maemo. Ofcourse, native is better, similar pro/con exist for WINE on Linux/x86-32 desktop.
I have not said "no" to JavaME. In fact, I continue insisting that we absolutely need JavaME on Maemo, because there are so many applications written in JavaME on the market.
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Goosfraba! All text written by allnameswereout is public domain unless stated otherwise. Thank you for sharing your output!
Goosfraba! All text written by allnameswereout is public domain unless stated otherwise. Thank you for sharing your output!
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2009-10-18
, 19:36
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Posts: 1,418 |
Thanked: 1,541 times |
Joined on Feb 2008
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#85
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Originally Posted by allnameswereout
I doubt Nokia will ever do anything about Android compatibility, so it is purely in the hands of community. As to J2ME, there is some hope.
As of now, more interesting is compatibility layer for Android, or even iPhone OS. I don't mean to run complete Android OS, but to run an application which is unique to Android without replacement/alternative/port on Maemo.
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2009-10-18
, 19:48
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Posts: 3,397 |
Thanked: 1,212 times |
Joined on Jul 2008
@ Netherlands
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#86
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Originally Posted by SubCore
Hi, I put this and your previous post on wiki so we can edit it easier. I added 2 'TODO' as well. The entry is Task:Brainstorm_Java. Please feel free to delete it after you made your Brainstorm entry.
very interesting, didn't know about that!
i will add it to the Java SE Proposal:
community or nokia builds Iced Tea
+) true GPL, no binary components
-) no team so far
-) no official advertising
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Goosfraba! All text written by allnameswereout is public domain unless stated otherwise. Thank you for sharing your output!
Goosfraba! All text written by allnameswereout is public domain unless stated otherwise. Thank you for sharing your output!
Last edited by allnameswereout; 2009-10-19 at 01:35.
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2009-10-19
, 00:57
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Posts: 2,014 |
Thanked: 1,581 times |
Joined on Sep 2009
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#87
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Originally Posted by bcaroll
I know all about Dalvik and regardless of what you call it its a JVM, and there is no friggin way in the world it runs at 80% of native C.
Unfortunately a lot of people, like you, think that there is a jvm in the Android platform. The vm used in Android is called Dalvik and it is not a jvm. The only thing Java about Android is the syntax and the syntax has little to do with performance. Thus your example has no relevance in the Java discussion.
The most important thing lacking in the Dalvik VM is a JIT. The difference in speed has been measured to 5-10 times faster with the JIT. The actual speed naturally depends on what you do but a better figure to use is that Java runs at about 80% of the speed of native programs.
If you had read all of my post you would have noticed that I see the need for some programs and parts of programs that run on the native platform.
However most applications are not image filtering and why would you want to to manage the memory of simple data lookup and entering app?
I think we have all see all those great C developers that "know" how handle memory of apps the leak memory, forcing us to restart the app regularly. A large number of security holes are due to developer that cannot handle a simple buffer overflow. I guess we have to expect a huge increase in mobile worms in the future.
What YOU apparently are unaware of is that Android has achieved a lot of its speed improvements by cutting huge chunks out of the standard Java API and by customizing the graphics layer instead of using swing. Simply adding Java to the n900 isnt going to give us the same performance.
Lastly - memory management is required in any and all apps. Particularly a data retrieval app where its easy to lost track of how much memory a data object is using.
__________________
Class .. : Power Poster, Potential Coder
Humor .. : [*********] Alignment: Chaotic Evil
Patience : [***-------] Weapon(s): +2 Logic Mace
Agro ... : |*****-----] Relic(s) : G1, N900
Class .. : Power Poster, Potential Coder
Humor .. : [*********] Alignment: Chaotic Evil
Patience : [***-------] Weapon(s): +2 Logic Mace
Agro ... : |*****-----] Relic(s) : G1, N900
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2009-10-19
, 01:31
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Posts: 316 |
Thanked: 150 times |
Joined on May 2006
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#88
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Originally Posted by fms
I don't usually get like this on forums, but your attitude is beginning to really annoy me.
Then, personally, I do not see any reason to support these. The only reason to support any kind of Java is to get access to existing library of applications.
Fine, you don't use Java or Java apps. Yes, we get that. In that case, the provision of a Java SE or Java ME layer will have zero impact on your usage of the device.
I can't think of any Ruby based apps off of the top of my head, but I welcome the availability (or development) of a ruby environment on the N900 (or any other platform) for the simple fact that it only increases options.
Let's look at the pros and cons of the Java environment being made available :-
Pros :
* Users can run Java (SE/ME) apps - if they want to ... no-one is forcing you to do so.
Cons :
* A few megs of storage space is used - you could spend a few minutes writing a shell script to delete all the Java stuff if you were that bothered,
There. That's it. Unless you have something constructive to say, please either STFU or find another thread, this one could probably use some attention.
@Everyone else - yeah, I've probably just fed an annoying, yet unusually persistent, troll - castigate me if you will.
| The Following User Says Thank You to jaark For This Useful Post: | ||
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2009-10-19
, 05:10
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Posts: 1,418 |
Thanked: 1,541 times |
Joined on Feb 2008
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#89
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Originally Posted by jaark
You are missing the point. The point was that people do use JavaME apps but not JavaSE apps. The point also was that it is only worth implementing frameworks that are in wide use.
Fine, you don't use Java or Java apps. Yes, we get that. In that case, the provision of a Java SE or Java ME layer will have zero impact on your usage of the device.
I can't think of any Ruby based apps off of the top of my head
Cons :
* A few megs of storage space is used - you could spend a few minutes writing a shell script to delete all the Java stuff if you were that bothered,
If you want Java to be present on tablets by default though, this will cost Nokia money and time developing and integrating it. Don't you think it should be counted among cons as well?
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2009-10-19
, 05:17
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Posts: 78 |
Thanked: 15 times |
Joined on Aug 2009
@ Melbourne
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#90
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Originally Posted by RevdKathy
okay this one give me a lil worry, i need to open blackboard on my browser as most of university in the world use this blackboard for their online learning tools.. i was thinking that blackboard need javascript not the javaSE...
JavaSE would indeed be what Blackboard runs. It has a forum system - I never worked out why it needed to be java. I can't reply to anything from an NHS computer because the java on those is out of date (they run XP with IE6and regular staff don't have admin access to update.) I was under the impression that n900 could handly that sort of java? Did I not see it running a chat applet in one of the videos? (Or did I dream that bit?)
so is there anyone here can confirm or try blackboard site on their N900? if they have one..
No phone from Nokia support eRCP, but eSWT is supported in all Nokia S60 phones from version 3.2.
There is the new Sprint Titan platform with OSGI Technology in the Mobile, it will be released very soon (???), with support first for eRCP (IBM/j9) on windows Mobile devices. I did not found so much about at http://developer.sprint.com/ , but I found this about developer Tools for the Sprint Titan Platform: http://developers.sun.com/mobility/c...oads/index.jsp