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2009-09-17
, 22:53
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Posts: 607 |
Thanked: 450 times |
Joined on Sep 2009
@ Washington, DC
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#82
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As a newcomer to the forums (and to Nokia, the N810, for that matter) I hesitate to say anything but, having just gone through a massive company, device, and user community meltdown (OQO, OQO 2+, OQOTalk), I thought I'd interject a bit of an outsider's perspective.
No hardware, no software, works. All of it has problems. No hardware or software is the best. All of it has pluses and minuses. It's not surprising that someone viewing a prototype N900 would find problems. It's also not surprising that someone who has viewed Samsung's concept of a Linux OS and compared it to Nokia's implementation of a Linux OS would find benefits in the concept. All of that misses the point.
The question is not how the N900 compares to other devices, the question is do enough people need what the N900 offers at the price the N900 carries? For the U.S., if Nokia can't find a carrier subsidy, the answer will be no, pure and simple. Sure, a few gadget addicts, possibly including myself, might try it out but it will be a toy. For the rest of the world, it might be a more difficult decision.
Customers aren't looking at reviews such as Eldar's. They are looking at glossy brochures and TV ads and maybe a generally positive review in a newspaper or magazine. Then they compare it to what they have now, not what might be available. If Nokia can't win that comparison, they won't make the sale.
Don't get overly upset when someone else doesn't recognize the value that you see in a device (and I saw many more dismissive reviews of the OQO than you will ever see of the N900). Understand that they may be right from their point of view and that doesn't mean that you can't also be right from your point of view. De gustibus non est disputandum.
No hardware, no software, works. All of it has problems. No hardware or software is the best. All of it has pluses and minuses. It's not surprising that someone viewing a prototype N900 would find problems. It's also not surprising that someone who has viewed Samsung's concept of a Linux OS and compared it to Nokia's implementation of a Linux OS would find benefits in the concept. All of that misses the point.
The question is not how the N900 compares to other devices, the question is do enough people need what the N900 offers at the price the N900 carries? For the U.S., if Nokia can't find a carrier subsidy, the answer will be no, pure and simple. Sure, a few gadget addicts, possibly including myself, might try it out but it will be a toy. For the rest of the world, it might be a more difficult decision.
Customers aren't looking at reviews such as Eldar's. They are looking at glossy brochures and TV ads and maybe a generally positive review in a newspaper or magazine. Then they compare it to what they have now, not what might be available. If Nokia can't win that comparison, they won't make the sale.
Don't get overly upset when someone else doesn't recognize the value that you see in a device (and I saw many more dismissive reviews of the OQO than you will ever see of the N900). Understand that they may be right from their point of view and that doesn't mean that you can't also be right from your point of view. De gustibus non est disputandum.
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2009-09-17
, 22:59
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Posts: 2,041 |
Thanked: 1,066 times |
Joined on Mar 2006
@ Houston
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#83
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Originally Posted by DaveP1
Valid point. But you need to understand a key difference. It is not Nokia's inabilitiy to find carriers to subsidize its smartphones that has resulted in the reduction of nokia as a strong contender in the US. Nokia is trying very hard to change the way carriers use thier clout in the US market at the expense of losing market share.
As a newcomer to the forums (and to Nokia, the N810, for that matter) I hesitate to say anything but, having just gone through a massive company, device, and user community meltdown (OQO, OQO 2+, OQOTalk), I thought I'd interject a bit of an outsider's perspective.
No hardware, no software, works. All of it has problems. No hardware or software is the best. All of it has pluses and minuses. It's not surprising that someone viewing a prototype N900 would find problems. It's also not surprising that someone who has viewed Samsung's concept of a Linux OS and compared it to Nokia's implementation of a Linux OS would find benefits in the concept. All of that misses the point.
The question is not how the N900 compares to other devices, the question is do enough people need what the N900 offers at the price the N900 carries? For the U.S., if Nokia can't find a carrier subsidy, the answer will be no, pure and simple. Sure, a few gadget addicts, possibly including myself, might try it out but it will be a toy. For the rest of the world, it might be a more difficult decision.
Customers aren't looking at reviews such as Eldar's. They are looking at glossy brochures and TV ads and maybe a generally positive review in a newspaper or magazine. Then they compare it to what they have now, not what might be available. If Nokia can't win that comparison, they won't make the sale.
Don't get overly upset when someone else doesn't recognize the value that you see in a device (and I saw many more dismissive reviews of the OQO than you will ever see of the N900). Understand that they may be right from their point of view and that doesn't mean that you can't also be right from your point of view. De gustibus non est disputandum.
Nokia can easily choose to subsidize the phone as seen here
http://www.mobilephonesdirect.co.uk/...62/p26078.aspx
Its just that it prefers not to because the system is totally broken in the US.
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2009-09-17
, 23:34
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Posts: 1,885 |
Thanked: 2,008 times |
Joined on Aug 2009
@ OVI MAPS
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#84
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freedom of speach and all that wecan pick and choose what things to question and i question everything i dont like and hype up things i do like
its human nature
i love n900, but dislike lack of portrait support out the box,
I liked eldars preview but dislike is recent attacks.
we should not be questioning if is journalism is good or bad, we should be questioning the motives behind it.
"i'll do big positive preview on leaked device on the eve of anouncement get lots of attention for me and my site"
"no longer getting attention anymore time to slam in900 and talk up another leaked device from competitor and make traffic fot my site again"
its human nature
i love n900, but dislike lack of portrait support out the box,
I liked eldars preview but dislike is recent attacks.
we should not be questioning if is journalism is good or bad, we should be questioning the motives behind it.
"i'll do big positive preview on leaked device on the eve of anouncement get lots of attention for me and my site"
"no longer getting attention anymore time to slam in900 and talk up another leaked device from competitor and make traffic fot my site again"
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2009-09-18
, 04:21
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Posts: 11,700 |
Thanked: 10,045 times |
Joined on Jun 2006
@ North Texas, USA
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#85
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Personally I thought the OQO was cool.
__________________
Nokia Developer Champion
Different <> Wrong | Listen - Judgment = Progress | People + Trust = Success
My personal site: http://texrat.net
Nokia Developer Champion
Different <> Wrong | Listen - Judgment = Progress | People + Trust = Success
My personal site: http://texrat.net
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2009-09-18
, 04:22
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Posts: 11,700 |
Thanked: 10,045 times |
Joined on Jun 2006
@ North Texas, USA
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#86
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Originally Posted by NvyUs
The two are inseparable in this context.
we should not be questioning if is journalism is good or bad, we should be questioning the motives behind it.
__________________
Nokia Developer Champion
Different <> Wrong | Listen - Judgment = Progress | People + Trust = Success
My personal site: http://texrat.net
Nokia Developer Champion
Different <> Wrong | Listen - Judgment = Progress | People + Trust = Success
My personal site: http://texrat.net
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2009-09-18
, 04:34
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Posts: 1,885 |
Thanked: 2,008 times |
Joined on Aug 2009
@ OVI MAPS
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#87
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I dont think questioning the motives is the same as just stating its bad or good journalism or that they are inseperable, what a reader views as bad journalism could be viewed as genius writing by his piers if the writing served the purpose it was set out to do.
I'm sure samsung will think its good and their loyal followers
so knowing the motivation serves a much more purpose as that remains the same but good or bad differs depending on who is reading
so it best to question motive not is journalism
Last edited by NvyUs; 2009-09-18 at 04:54.
I'm sure samsung will think its good and their loyal followers
so knowing the motivation serves a much more purpose as that remains the same but good or bad differs depending on who is reading
so it best to question motive not is journalism
Last edited by NvyUs; 2009-09-18 at 04:54.
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2009-09-18
, 21:52
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Posts: 1,540 |
Thanked: 1,045 times |
Joined on Feb 2007
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#88
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Originally Posted by christexaport
If it's designed for a 2011 release then it clearly isn't even a prototype but more of a concept model. You never design any piece of mobile hardware two years in advance, there would be major changes by the time of release. We'll probably be using the first 4G networks by 2011, for example.
While we sit and TRYto find ways to gain momentum in making Maemo even better down the line, Samsung has its own Linux based smartphone/tablet device in development. Eldar Murtazin of Mobile-Review has had a chance to review an early prototype, and he's more impressed with the Samsung model
, which isn't planned until 2011, than the N900 which is coming in a month or two.
Just like cars, designing a concept phone is much easier than designing a production phone. Production phones have to be manufactured in batches of millions using components that keep the price to a reasonable level, and that's where the flaws usually creep in.
If you want to compare things it has to be like for like, otherwise it's a meaningless comparison.
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2009-09-18
, 22:21
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Posts: 11,700 |
Thanked: 10,045 times |
Joined on Jun 2006
@ North Texas, USA
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#89
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Originally Posted by NvyUs
My comments were not made in a general sense, which is why I said in this context.
I dont think questioning the motives is the same as just stating its bad or good journalism or that they are inseperable,
In a general sense, conversants need to agree on definitions of "bad"; do we mean poor or malicious? One speaks to education, the other to ethics.
__________________
Nokia Developer Champion
Different <> Wrong | Listen - Judgment = Progress | People + Trust = Success
My personal site: http://texrat.net
Nokia Developer Champion
Different <> Wrong | Listen - Judgment = Progress | People + Trust = Success
My personal site: http://texrat.net
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2009-09-22
, 03:02
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Posts: 1,258 |
Thanked: 672 times |
Joined on Mar 2009
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#90
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Originally Posted by sachin007
Surely that's not Nokia subsidizing the device? It's the Operator subsidizing it, right?
Nokia can easily choose to subsidize the phone as seen here
http://www.mobilephonesdirect.co.uk/...62/p26078.aspx
Its just that it prefers not to because the system is totally broken in the US.
I disagreed even more after I read this:
http://conversations.nokia.com/2008/...aches-for-all/