Notices

Hi everyone,

I'm currently playing with Garnet in an emulated N800 (see thread here) so I can learn more about how it works, and unearth any interesting "tricks" it can do.

I've made some progress, but am somewhat held back by a lack of general information and resources about how GVM works internally.

There are a few (understandably) hesitant threads floating around here talking about availability of GVM in general. As everyone probably knows, it disappeared off the website a long time ago. That's one significant part of my difficulty, and I'd appreciate PMs in this regard

The other thing I'm a bit intimidated about with is how gvmlauncher and gvm talk to each other. The closest I've come thus far is this thread talking about gras-client, which is very interesting. If anyone happens to know more than is documented in that thread, please do let me know, either in this thread (if you have general info that may benefit others) or via PM (for protocol discussion and similar).

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While you're here, I wanted to note something tangentially related that I am very interested to learn more about.

Anybody who poked around with this stuff back in the day may vaguely recall that the gvm_dev_kit included a Windows emulator called Janeiro, which basically ran Garnet on top of armel linux - the exact same scenario as what the Maemo version does.

Well, apparently Cobalt was ported to Janeiro too (incidentally without Linux underneath). I learned about this in this tiny reddit thread while hunting around for old URLs.

Any information or leads you may have about this (and similarly-interesting subjects) would be greatly appreciated, either as a comment or (if your response is a few megabytes long, for whatever reason) a PM.

(I get the impression the website had a lot of interesting things on it back in the day. I was sadly never able to download many of them when they were available.)

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Note regarding the initial few comments below - my original approach with this thread didn't take into account the legal responsibilities this (official) forum cannot cast aside with regards to software licensing and distribution. This is what caused the appropriately freaked-out response, and my initial "woops" and temporary deletion.

After the followup and encouragement (see further down), I currently figure it's less noisy to edit this post instead of leaving it in limbo and making yet another.

I think what you are doing is a great idea...new guy..
But for one eensy teensy weensy little thing.

I would suggest you copy your entire post...
And delete from TMO forums your preceding post..
And replace it with a brief and general mention of a off forum "discussion" of Garnet.

Put the preceding post on a private blog or something of the sort...
Where only those who contact you directly and whom are Maemo members of for some time (to easily and safely screen folks.)
And give them the link to said blog .
This way... everything is above board.

Contrary to what you may think.
There has been continued interest in Garnet.
But it is done ...shall we say ..quietly.

Here at TMO ..there are precious few things that are not advised to do.
And you are doing one of them right now.

Due to the ownership of Garnet.
And the legality and liability...of freely posting copies of the owned material...even mentioning dissemination of copies...
You put yourself, others here and TMO itself ...legally ...
in a bad spot with your post ..
I strongly suggest that you alter the post and tuck the original onto a private blog or such....
accessible to only those who you screen.

I do not suggest you leave the post up as it is..
Nor add to it...
Nor insert any copies of Garnet you may have or may acquire from others.

Whooooops. My sincere apologies.

Heh, a blog. I've wanted one of those for a very long time, over a decade actually. (Well, specifically I'm looking for a blogging _platform_ that won't drive me to distraction...)

So, I don't really have anywhere to move this, but out of respect I've deleted it without waiting. (After of course hitting Edit and making a backup of the (carefully-composed >.<) bbCode, heh.)

Time changes things. Sometimes. For example, software bitrots - I have had a *very* fun time getting an emulated N800 working.

It would be so wonderful if the same concepts applied to the not-so-technical sides of things. I'd half-hoped, half-assumed that maybe... but sadly this does not appear to be the case. Thinking about it, though, something like this isn't being lost in the flood of 20,000 other "boring" posts, and I can see that maybe being a bit of a problem given various proximities.

Ah well, this fell through big-time, now I gotta go back to the drawing board.

"Short time, and thanks for the couple of fish "

you do not need to abandon your project.
but you must (in particular with Garnet) be careful for your sake, others, and TMO in general ...what you post concerning Garnet ...in particular...dissemination of Garnet.
Cease and Desist and Litigation notices ...may not happen..but it hasn't been tested publicly concerning Garnet dissemination of owned material...
So erring on the side of caution and prudence is wise..

I do heartily suggest you continue with your endeavour ..
You must be cautious though...
make it some sort of private thing...
So you can screen folks..
and that is easy...hence the blog suggestion...
Or..it could be any of a number of other ideas that could work..


the search tool will bring up countless threads on a topic ..
Nothing is lost here..
Just "not in immediate field of vision"

BTW
pm me that list ...I didn't get a long look at it.

and ...I have to ask...
why use an emulator ?
Don't tell me you don't have a n800?
or is it so you won't mess with and bork your n800 experimenting ?

Thanks very much for the follow-up of/and encouragement. It is most appreciated - I felt slightly squashed, albeit for totally understandable reasons, and I could not fault the squashing

I can't help but agree that given the proximity of the Maemo project, the letters you mention would prove quite the mosquito for many groups. I definitely don't want to cause anything like that coming from this direction.

So now I just need to figure out how on earth to give my idea the reach it would be nice for this to have (it's Palm-oriented, FWIW, as opposed to Maemo-oriented, so there's at least that).

Regarding emulation, it definitely has its annoyances (eg, learning that GCC makes my laptop get to 72°C until I remembered that scratchbox is actually, um, like, a **cross-compilation environment** - sadly such goings around in circles are not especially uncommon for me.......), but emulation is also great in the sense that it makes it a lot easier to take software to bits and see how it works without needing to worry about breaking the environment it's in. It also makes it possible to let others run software originally designed to run on a specific device, without needing the device, which aids development efforts too.

That being said, I must admit that I don't have any N series stuff.

The N770 found its way across my screen at some point and I immediately knew what my new favorite gadget was (IIRC I actually dug around and learned about it almost as soon as I discovered it, which wasn't usual for me circa 2007). Then the N800 and N810 followed, and my jaw all but hit the floor. Yup yup and yup, I can has all of them?

Sadly I never got a chance to play with one, as the Super Ultra Extremely Smart And Expressly Customer-Focused telcos here in Australia decided they weren't interesting. It would only have been possible for me to get such a device on a plan at that point. (The closest I came was tinkering with an N8, which was Symbian. Eh, EPOC was nice (I found an Ericsson MC218 (Psion Series 5 clone/rebrand) in an op-shop one day, that was awesome), but Symbian isn't Maemo :P)

I've had a bit of an odd situation with gadgets and tech in general for a very long time, mostly due to a bunch of health conditions which prevent me from working and also involve notable expense (quite the catch-22). I'm getting to the point where I really really do need to get my first smartphone (last used a dumbphone circa 2006, until I couldn't justify keeping it connected) - the reason I've managed to hold off for as long as I have is that I'm hyper-conscious of all the bloatware, inflexibility and ease of monitoring that ships by default in Android, and I 100% know I'll be driven *beyond* distraction if I can't rebuild the system from source... but my current hardware 100% cannot handle compiling large projects (building just LLVM near killed it about a year ago, and I never tried anything else after that xD).

Hm, this went a bit distracted. Uh, anyway... I continue making small bits of progress with my idea, and have now added figuring out how to tell people about the idea to my problem-solving queue.

Vaguely asking others for "information" concerning garnet or iterations of garnet is harmless enough..
It is all in the wording...
As long as you do not directly infer or directly disseminate copies of garnet in plain view here ...write whatever findings you come to...by all means..

There are ways of saying things without the liability hazard.
So you can continue...
Just handle the issue of copy sharing delicately.

Sure.

Now to figure out how to actually word a take-two that heads in the direction of my original goal. I'll try and do this tomorrow (well, later on today ).

I'm also wondering whether I should edit this post I've already made (which is somewhat in limbo), or make a new post.

I always like to ask in these threads what old palm software are you looking to run in Garnet. Not a dig, I also emulate my TI-83, I think in the past I Garnet'ed some PalmOS celestial navigation software.
The problem with most Palm software is the database info is now very out of date and/or if online the API is long dead.

Correct bike...
Or is it Mr Tool...

There is a healthy segment of garnets stuff dependent on a current database...

Which reminds me...
We used to have a great maemallian (like that name ..��)
Some of the older folks here will remember him.
He had a veritble ton of garnet software ...
Stuff no one else had.
I haven't seen him for a while now...its been a few years at least.
I am sure he still has all his goodies.
The moment I recall his username I will post it here ..
And whoever wishes to contact him for garnet / palm help / stuff...then they can pm him.