Nokia Q1 financials
 

http://investors.nokia.com/phoenix.z...rterlyearnings

Heading in the right direction

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Except for US. ;)

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Indeed texrat, for me it seems that the tech media in USofA enjoys to rip Nokia off... They twist the words to make sound worse than it is.

Just look at that "news" site called engadget. Palm is dying but they manage to put a finger print covered blood in Nokia news...

Is it more of "buy american" combined with USofA not being anymore such a power house in Mobile? or just the usual bashing of the funny europeans?

ps. I am not making fun, sounds that I am a bit sour with USofA but actually it is just with the media... I guess I watch too much CNN and MSNBC.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

It was pretty bad quarter. No idea what the USA media is saying, but the finnish media isn't happy either.

Symbian^3 delay is very bad news. Nokia needs to get S^3 out before Android eats the market. Nokia's brand strenght alone can't keep the current Android push at bay. Sales down -30% in europe during past 3 months. That's really terrible even if the usual past-christmas slowdown is taken into account.

Only good news was the suprise profit from Nokia Siemens Networks.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Symbian 3 being delayed is extremely bad news.. I don't know how they are going to recover from this. Especially if symbian 3 is just mediocre or only updating the OS to current standards. It needs to be new and fresh while offering features not available on other smart phones. It can't just be a "lets catch up" situation.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

A couple of month's delay wouldn't be a disaster, but this product is probably even more important than the N900. As great as Maemo is, Nokia's brand image is suffering so much that even people buying 50 euro phones might start looking elsewhere due to the constant media bashing.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Symbian 3 being delayed because of quality issues.
in "engineering" speak:

The code is poor quality and the UI is no cohesive or has good usability. This is usually caused by poor dev managers, junior coders, no best practices in place and allowing developers to bully QA/UI teams.

Either
-Finland has extream labor laws restricting them from firing bad employees
- they are dirt cheap and only hire junior engineers
- everyone is scared of being fired and no one speaks up when something is wrong
- extreme nepotism, politics in the workplace

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Symbian 3 being delayed is extremely bad news.. I don't know how they are going to recover from this. Especially if symbian 3 is just mediocre or only updating the OS to current standards. It needs to be new and fresh while offering features not available on other smart phones. It can't just be a "lets catch up" situation.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

You have to understand the US as well, they love apple and they love MS and google. So Android, iphone with the MS exchange thing is big over there. Nokia's last few phones have bombed over there when you compare the ease of use from the other big players, and the money they throw at product advers, development and more impiortantly support. Let's be honest Nokia are pushing a dead horse in symbian and maemo has already changed names to another style without really leaving the blocks.

Active sync is defacto for vista and win7, nokia pc suite isn't.

So the following isn't there when you compare the likes of iphone or android which is churning out model after model. Without that customer following you ain't got nowt..

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Wildly guessing I'd bet on your first two. Nokia's last decade of software could probably provide Daily WTF material for a year if we could just get at the source. IMHO it's improving, but not fast enough.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Quote: Sales down -30% in europe during past 3 months.

Thats a QoQ number, quite irrelevant. YoY sales have gone
up except in North America.


Quote: Especially if symbian 3 is just mediocre or only updating the OS to current standards.

Technically symbian 3 will be a huge update. Symbian 4 is only a new Qt-based UI.


Quote: The code is poor quality and the UI is no cohesive or has good usability. This is usually caused by poor dev managers, junior coders, no best practices in place and allowing developers to bully QA/UI teams.

Do you have Insider-knowledge? Or looked at the code?

Cheers

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

There is no doubt that the emphasis in Espoo has not been in UI performance, I remember reading a Nokia engineer saying that until the the iPhone launched they had never placed any emphasis on 'smoothness' in the UI only functionality. Symbian foundation realizes that UI is now the selling feature (IMHO moreso than apps) for launching a new device and so this delay must be to iron out issues and deliver a worthy product.
Nokia isn't going anywhere soon but they really only have a couple of years to turn things around in the high end smartphone category that they defined for many years.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

15 years of development experience in large projects($200 Million annual per project). If you have quality issues this far down the road, it's generally because the whole project has been mis-managed.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

No, they have this year. That's it. Otherwise all 3rd party services will be locked into Android and Apple. The 1st MeeGo device has to be amazing, and the N8 has to match the iPhone in simplicity. There are no other options.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

http://tabulacrypticum.wordpress.com...to-launch-big/

:D

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Just look at the awesome phones Dell just announced

http://www.engadget.com/2010/04/21/d...ice-leaks-out/

Nokia is supposed to be creating wow's and ahhhs with phone releases. No one ever complains about Noki'a hardware, is their hard-on for Symbian going to be their downfall. They have not yet shown they are any good at software at the same level as Apple or Google.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

To be perfectly clear, this is where Nokia is right now.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Quote: If you have quality issues this far down the road, it's generally because the whole project has been mis-managed.

I guess you mean s60 5th edition by quality issues. I had N82 and E71 and was completely satisfied by the software quality from a user perspective.

Quote: No, they have this year. That's it. Otherwise all 3rd party services will be locked into Android and Apple. The 1st MeeGo device has to be amazing, and the N8 has to match the iPhone in simplicity. There are no other options.

My god, how alarmist.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Agree If you mean that Nokia is team Russia in that video.


(In the lead, but Android coming fast from behind).

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

No. Nokia is behind, but with more players on the ice. They have to score now or it's over.

I am not being alarmist. It isn't even just about apps. The N900 will not carry Nokia's image much longer, and image is critical. It doesn't matter if they can dominate the low to mid end, because the media will hate them as long as they don't have an "iPhone". It'll suddenly be uncool to have any kind of Nokia, and people will flock to Samsung.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

It was alarmist, but odds are he's right. Nokia cannot forestall the inevitable forever. Sooner or later the company will no longer be able to ride the wave of past success.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

net losses. geezz

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

they had 3 years to revamp an already established OS, in which other NEWER competitors have managed to create OS's (android, WebOS).

What the hell are Nokia doing?

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Ok I agree with your sentiment, but that video isn't really the best one to higlight it. Nokia used to own this market and are still in the lead. It's been a market for Nokia to lose, not to win.

I got a feeling that better finnish hockey classic might be that Fin vs. Swe match that was 5-0 and ended 5-6 (Nokia vs Android ecosystem).

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

You have a point. But as long as it's not FIN-USA 2010... :D

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Hardware like that will become ubiquitous in the near future. It's all about software and services. As you said, nokia has to compete with apple, google and microsoft in that regard. Not exactly an easy task. But their positioning is good, execution is lacking a bit :-).

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

The E71 was the most stable and satisfying (major functions worked as advertised in an awesome form factor) it phone I've ever used.

However, the E72 was such a small increment, Nokia wasn't showing much vision. Did they fall prey to the N95 mentality => milking a decent phone to death and forget future innovation?

Put whoever was in charge of E71 in terms of quality and stability in charge of everything!

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

From techies to Financial Analysts all of a sudden.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

NOkia has got to advertise!!!! they dont advertise over here in the usa. how are peeps supposed to know about them? most cell manufacturers kinda get help with ads via the newwork they operate on. BUT NOT NOKIA!!! who even knows what symbian 3 is besides geeks and current nokia users? NOW who knows what android is???
EVERY BODY!!
including my mom who is over 50 years old! she even knows what a APP is!!!! who the hellever heard of symbian^3 or even symbian for tha tmatter? enthusiasts and nokia owners

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

I take it you're new here. ;)

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Nokia certainly isn't in an enviable position right now. Symbian^4 and Harmattan devices (early 2011 and late 2010 respectively) are the only things in the high end that are worth looking forward to IMHO. Anything before that including the N8 are just something they need to do in order to retain at least some relevance while others are pushing stuff out left and right.

Samsung and LG are very tough in the midrange TS phones where Nokia is expanding and the cheapo Chinese phones are eating their lowest end.

Their bad performance in North America affects their image in the English speaking web/press which I think is kind of contagious on this side of the pond too. I've been thinking about what they need to do to get some buzz going and I thought I'd never say this but they need carrier support from a major American operator. It seems to me that getting a high end model to an American carrier is kind of a "seal of approval" for the US tech blogs and buyers. The carrier flagship phones, iPhone, Droid, Pre etc. seem to get an enormous amount of exposure. Obviously that's futile if there aren't competitive devices, which again I don't see before Harmattan or S^4.

Addition: I think the brand still has quite a lot of power. Long time Nokia users looking for high end products are frustrated because Nokia doesn't have much to offer and are moving to alternatives. But I also think if and when Nokia gets something really competitive out the brand helps a lot in converting those people back.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

and very bad at the financial analysis - Nokia means nothin in the US - oh no you cry - last year US sales made up 5% of their market

The fact aht us sales are down to 4% is really rather unimportnat

Overall sales in Europe (their main market) are broadly in line with inflation and overall sales are up by 16%. So until Apple start selling in china (oh wait that will never happen as they are way to expensive!) Nokia have some captive markets

Android is the real threat but I think Nokia phones are not as slick as the iphone, but they are as touch screen aware and as slick as most android phones. My girly has a cheap Nokia - do you realise how powerful these things are - set Nav e-mail web browser etc. Once those get apps that will be the biggest market for selling them

Nokia are not in much danger of vanishing at the moment

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

No, you're missing half the picture. Keep in mind what I and this guy said:

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Why would people flock to samsung - they don't have an iphone (or good press) either

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Symbian^4 has been hyped up a lot, but after reading the roadmaps I'm not so convinced of it. Symbian^3, if it lives up to promises, will get 95% there.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Doing badly? Hmm. QoQ in general and smartphones they increased their marketshare. Ditto for profits.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Samsung doesn't have the iPhone's press, but Nokia is the one getting all the negative press. If Nokia becomes uncool, Samsung is the best neutral alternative for cheap phones.

You may think it's unfair, but since Nokia is the biggest, everyone is expecting better of them. If they fail while everyone is looking at them...

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

I think most people don't think that much about phones

A lot more choose on price and features - and nokia is doing fine in that battle ground

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Symbian^4 is the first to have the whizzbang HW accelerated animated UI and a new application suite. Symbian^3 provides a lot of important under the hood stuff, but UI wise I think it's just patchwork for the same old S60 UI. And if there isn't much new the users can _see_ I don't think specs alone will be able to get enough attention. Symbian^3 might introduce some UI concepts/flow that'll be in Symbian^4 though. That's what I think Maemo 5 is also doing with regard to MeeGo(Harmattan).

Smartphones did well, but the average selling price wasn't all that great, 155 e. I'd be worried if this pushing smartphones to lower price points strategy didn't increase volumes. It also just occurred to me that in the earnings call they didn't announce Nseries and Eseries volumes separately from the lower end smartphones like they have before. Not sure if this means anything though.

Re: Nokia Q1 financials
 

Agree fully.


Android is exploding in the most important markets (EU + advanced Asia). Huawei, ZTE, Samsung et al will soon start pumping lower mid-range/low-end Android phones into developing markets.

It has taken few years for Android to mature, but it has now finally merged as great platform and ecosystem. Nokia can't simply rely on brand anymore. S^3 can't come fast enough. Android has the ability to take the position that Nokia currently holds.