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harriva is offline harriva
2010-07-01 , 14:59
Posts: 61 | Thanked: 43 times | Joined on Aug 2008
#41
Originally Posted by smoku View Post
Doh... There is a BIG difference for publishers between App Store and Ovi Store.
You don't need to be business for publishing to App Store and you need to be business (VAT number requirement) for publishing to Ovi Store.

Show me those hobbyist programmers that are eager to register a company just to post his 1 euro app to Ovi.
https://publish.ovi.com/register/cou...d_account_type
Select "Personal" if you wish to publish content as an individual on the Ovi Store.
But there is still that 50€ registering fee.
 
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Nathraiben is offline Nathraiben
2010-07-01 , 15:01
Posts: 267 | Thanked: 408 times | Joined on May 2010 @ Austria
#42
Originally Posted by bchliu View Post
Very true.. but something even truer is the self satisfaction and inner rewards does not feed you (and the family) nor does it pay the constant bills.

This becomes an ethical debate of money. As much as most of the advocates in this forum is use to the idea of free Linux and ideals of Freeware/GPL, it really does not work in the real world of commercialism (which funnily enough, is what our society is based upon). In fact, what did we use to buy our N900's in the first place? or the constant phone bills that is associate with it?
I don't remember anybody talking about how commercial soft- or hardware were a bad thing. Juise- was just replying to the non-sense capitalism fanboy statement that nobody in their right mind would ever do anything good for free.

No, the warm, fuzzy feeling when you know that something you did helped other people does not feed me (working for a company does). But the insolent assumption that what I write in my spare time just has to be crap, because if it was any good I wouldn't give it away for free, makes me want to throw up.

I haven't spend THAT much time so far coding for this community, but there are others out there who spent dozens of hours to develop highly useful (and by now pretty much bug-free) applications because of prestige, the fun that comes with creating something useful and/or *gasp* simply out of generosity. Calling them idiots for doing something that "does not feed them" and belittling their work as half-finished, low-quality junk is more than just a slap into their faces.

By the way... we're still waiting for those ominous two applications that he's missing. Unless he comes out with what he's looking for, I call that an empty claim.
Last edited by Nathraiben; 2010-07-01 at 15:05. Reason: Typing while angry further decreases my poor English... ;)
 

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Nathraiben is offline Nathraiben
2010-07-01 , 15:08
Posts: 267 | Thanked: 408 times | Joined on May 2010 @ Austria
#43
Originally Posted by harriva View Post
But there is still that 50€ registering fee.
In all fairness, you have to pay Apple a yearly fee for the right to publish anything, too. AND you have to buy one of their overpriced desktops beforehand...

Right now the real big difference between AppStore and OVI is the fact that OVI doesn't work half of the time.
 
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juise- is offline juise-
2010-07-01 , 15:10
Posts: 186 | Thanked: 192 times | Joined on Jan 2010 @ Finland
#44
Originally Posted by bchliu View Post
Very true.. but something even truer is the self satisfaction and inner rewards does not feed you (and the family) nor does it pay the constant bills.
Which is exactly why I do have a "real" job.

And I'm not trying to disregard paid software in any way. For bigger tasks, some kind of paid model is often necessary to get the work done.

My points above are mostly from the viewpoint of a solo developer doing small pieces of software (e.g. a couple of weeks worth of work), and trying to make a point that there are some cases where just giving that piece of software away for free makes more sense than trying to sell it.

This becomes an ethical debate of money.
At least my post doesn't make it become ethical, all my listed reasons are either self-beneficial or neutral. Not single one of them suggests that getting paid for work is somehow evil.
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Last edited by juise-; 2010-07-01 at 15:34.
 
fahadj2003 is offline fahadj2003
2010-07-01 , 15:34
Banned | Posts: 778 | Thanked: 337 times | Joined on Jun 2010
#45
did u get ur n900 for free?

Originally Posted by johnel View Post
= Stupid assertion.

Many good apps on the n900 exist - I suggest actually using your app manager and trying them out.

There is a lack of commercial interest in apps because:
1) a few months ago there was huge uncertainty about the future of maemo
2) Nokia were very, very quiet almost embarrassed to talk about maemo and n900
3) when Nokia did say something one particlular director said no free mapping software for maemo5 and n900 maybe next version of maemo
4) OVI store is an utter, utter fail
5) maemo5 has reached maturity and stability with PR1.2 update but Nokia thought "awwww f*** it!", moved away from maemo5 and decided to start all over again with meego
6) Nokia don't get this "app store" business and unfortunately lost any chance of being a serious competitor with iPhone and Android . (That genuinely is a shame).
7) Nokia are so busy planning and formulating stratagies then life is passing them right by
8) All theses points mean that Nokia is unable to compete with high-end smartphones and have hit their ceiling
9) Nothing will change until some serious management and director changes take place within Nokia.
i agree with the guy, ovi store is a big fail..
not coz it lacks apps
its coz there arent many apps..
how many apps do u actually see?
i mean, if ovi aint workin, ppl gotta distribute their app somehow
perhaps on their site?
who are those ppl?
a company for bounce and angry bitds
offsets
then docs to go company
secret exit *zen bound*
i think tahts pretty much all of it?
how many more can u add?
make 10 companies?
still hell of alot less then s60
paid and free apps, they started coming out in the very next 1 or 2 months after the release of 5800..
Originally Posted by juise- View Post
There are several cases where giving app away "for free" makes sense. Some bullet points follow.

* You want to advertise yourself. Being able to point out at a job interview, "oh and I made this app for N900, just for the fun of it, it has about 100k downloads" is going to contribute on the positive side.

* Selling is a lot of work. Not all of us like to sell things, and when you do, your product must be excellent or you get a lot of complaints. Sometimes just giving away is easier, especially when expected sales number is not high. Skipping the selling part let's the developer focus on where he excels.

* Making a copy costs nothing. There might be a piece of software you wrote for yourself. But why not let anyone else to use it too, it's not like you lose something with that.

* Encouraging others to give their software away for free, too. This is my personal favourite. Imagine that your good free software inspires 10 other people to also share their work (or keep working on something they already give for free). You have just got 10 people to work for your good.

* Cooperation gets the best total score in the Prisoner's Dilemma.

* Raising the bar for non-free apps. Sometimes you find out you have paid for a piece of crap, and know you could do better. Implementing and giving away a proper implementation forces the for-profit guys to actually work for their profit.

* You just get your kicks from doing something good, and seeing other people enjoying it.

* Other. I'll use myself as an example. I wrote a piece of software called battery-eye. You can get it for free. When I got my N900 and stumbled on these forums, a lot of people seemed to have battery problems due to various software bugs. Worse, there seemed no way for people to communicate the problem accurately. The point of my app is to give the average user a way to see that something is wrong, so (s)he can complain, and hopefully force Nokia and other developers to fix obvious battery drains out of their software. Being an N900 owner, this is a direct benefit for me.


The above points really are just various realisations of that there's more to life than your bank account balance. Not every thing you do in your life directly translates to money, but it can still bring you personal benefit.
i'm not asking u to sell ur apps
u're not a company
ofcourse its a hard job for jus one man

why do a job?
lets all sit at home
ppl get us food but why do we have to pay?
arent they a community too?
lets all call em "open source" and not earn a ****
everything is free
but the thing is..
this is the real life
ppl will strip and make porn for money
u go to a village, ppl are dying out of hunger
they care about that money

another thing is, this argument isnt about money *yet again*
its about efficiency and variety of the apps

all here are accusations, nothing genuine
i'm sure ure all doing hard.. making apps
and i gladly appreciate that
but this is not relevant nor this was an offence
it was a simple question to share ur thoughts about drm
geez!
this is the 3rd time im repeating the same thing
:|
 
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smoku is offline smoku
2010-07-01 , 15:35
Posts: 1,716 | Thanked: 3,007 times | Joined on Dec 2009 @ Warsaw, Poland
#46
Originally Posted by cashclientel View Post
Oh yeah sorry, the minimal fee to register a company and become sales tax registered (£25 or so in the UK + a few forms) is such a put off. This is certainly the reason why the App Store and Ovi Store are like they are.
It takes about a week of waiting and visits in three different government organizations filling a few forms each. And cost is about 100 euro.
But the more problematic is that you need to account differently. Instead of one form per year it's two forms per month. And health and retirement insurance is payed differently. About 150% the amount you pay being hired. And you need to pay it no matter whether you're making profit or not.

So, I'm glad it's piece of cake for you. But it's not so simple in other countries.
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smoku is offline smoku
2010-07-01 , 15:37
Posts: 1,716 | Thanked: 3,007 times | Joined on Dec 2009 @ Warsaw, Poland
#47
Originally Posted by gerbick View Post
Quite wrong. Microsoft has DRM on Windows Media, Play Ready, and a method to sign/authenticate drivers, WHQL which now supports HDMI and Blu-Ray output to validated media displays, among other DRM methods, SDK's and options within that platform.

Windows is perhaps the worst example to bring up in a DRM conversation. It's downright saddled with them.
Haven't you notice that the thread is about apps?
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smoku is offline smoku
2010-07-01 , 15:38
Posts: 1,716 | Thanked: 3,007 times | Joined on Dec 2009 @ Warsaw, Poland
#48
Originally Posted by harriva View Post
https://publish.ovi.com/register/cou...d_account_type


But there is still that 50€ registering fee.
Looks like they finally noticed.
When I was registering for Ovi Store, there was no Personal option.
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juise- is offline juise-
2010-07-01 , 15:44
Posts: 186 | Thanked: 192 times | Joined on Jan 2010 @ Finland
#49
Originally Posted by Nathraiben View Post
Juise- was just replying to the non-sense capitalism fanboy statement that nobody in their right mind would ever do anything good for free.
In capitalism, zero or negative prices for single items are perfectly valid. It's just not called sales, but an investment.

Look at the subsidised phones given away for free with mobile subscriptions for an example.

It's the bottom line that counts.
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pantera1989 is offline pantera1989
2010-07-01 , 15:44
Posts: 577 | Thanked: 699 times | Joined on Feb 2010 @ Malta
#50
Originally Posted by fahadj2003 View Post
did u get ur n900 for free?
it was a simple question to share ur thoughts about drm
geez!
this is the 3rd time im repeating the same thing
:|
Read your first post please.

so we wont see any good apps/games from other companies?
good = not free
coz s60v5 had many apps in its first few months and honestly, all maemo has are repeated apps *different names, same features* or kinda apps not usually needed my many
how close am i?
is maemo a fail?
It seems like you think all the apps and games in the repositories are cr*p.

If you had asked a simple and polite question, users would have answered politely. Next time try this:

"Is the lack of professionally developed apps and games due to the lack of DRM on the N900? What do you guys think?"
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Last edited by pantera1989; 2010-07-01 at 15:47.
 

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