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2012-10-10
, 22:53
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Posts: 322 |
Thanked: 218 times |
Joined on Feb 2012
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#42
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Originally Posted by gerbick
I think I said some more than just that.
So... that's all you can say? Really?
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2012-10-10
, 23:03
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Posts: 322 |
Thanked: 218 times |
Joined on Feb 2012
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#43
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Originally Posted by NokiaFanatic
Symbian still is an "old school" smartphone OS. Powerful regarding HW, but weak in web/mail and apps.
I don't actually disagree with any of that. Like I said, the N8 was an excellent device, especially compared to the Galaxy (loads of people are still using the N8 today compared to the Galaxy which dated horribly). The problem Nokia had was perception and the legacy of selling some really awful phones previously (N97, I am looking at you).
When Ios and Android were released, they just looked so much more fresher than Symbian. What Nokia should have done was to ditch the Symbian name (and all its confusing variants). The next thing they should have done was completely reskin the OS. The default icons, fonts and menus looked terrible and dated, even if they were perfectly functional. Unfortunately, people were unable to look beyond this superficial detail, shame really
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2012-10-11
, 02:12
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Posts: n/a |
Thanked: 0 times |
Joined on
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#44
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Originally Posted by switch-hitter
Wait... wait. Isn't that just a way of saying that Nokia didn't sell enough? A flat percentage of sales in a growing market is basically the same as not meeting demand and thus, losing sales. And that's what happened.
Just to clarify, sales of Symbian devices were not falling they were just not growing as fast as the overall market.
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2012-10-11
, 02:13
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Posts: n/a |
Thanked: 0 times |
Joined on
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#45
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Originally Posted by specc
C'mon dawg... you gotta have more than that to say.
I think I said some more than just that.
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2012-10-11
, 05:54
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Posts: 322 |
Thanked: 218 times |
Joined on Feb 2012
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#46
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Originally Posted by switch-hitter
No no no! What happened was that the iPhone created a market for smartphones for "ordinary" people.Then Android came and strengthened and widened that market. Pre-iPhone, smartphones were toys for geeks and "advanced users" exclusively. In this new market the users went from using dumbphones (from Nokia) to using smartphones running iOS/Android. That new market grew way faster than the growth of Nokia smartphone sales, thus even though Nokia sold more smartphones than ever, they lost both total device market share and in particular - smartphone market share.
Symbian very successfully competed in the 'new world of easy going touch screen smartphones' right up until Elop deprecated it, that is a verifiable, undeniable fact
Now, you can argue that neither the iPhone or any Android phones are real smartphones, they are just more advanced dumphones with touch screens. That is correct IMO, but it is a moot point, because people wanted iPhones and Androids. (multitasking vs non-multitasking debate for instance). People (in Europe) threw away their old Nokias and got themselves an iPhone or an Android.
Nokias answer was the 8500. This phone was rather successful. They also had the N97, which was a disaster of unprecedented magnitude. But the clunkiness of the 8500, sent many people away, and when Symbian^3 came, the clunkyness was still there. Even today, Belle FP2 is laughable compared with iOS and Android UI,and in particular Metro. I like Belle, I personally don't mind some clunkiness, but the average person has no taste for this and the lack of apps and good games.
Elop had nothing to do with this. He wasn't even in the picture. The leaked memo, although foolish, didn't change a single thing of the basic facts.
Today we have very few real (old school) smartphones left. The 808 is for all practical purposes the only one. Do I want to dismiss a fluid UI, a lightening fast browser, totally integrated and a fluid mail/messaging/social network - for USB2go, FM TX and super camera? I'm not so sure. I would rather have it all - and with a qwerty HW keyboard. Problem is, that device does not exist. Android/iOS - been there, done that, utterly boring. So, Lumia 920 or the 808, that is the question.
That is why I like Nokia, that is why I like WP. In this world of advanced but utterly boring dumbphones (smartphones), Nokia is the only manufacturer that have something I want. Far from my personal dream device, but much closer than any competing device.
Maemo/Meego/N9 could have been cool, but realistically it would never succeed for anything but a niche. That niche would be my niche, but the N9 was a step in the wrong direction. The N9 is too clunky for the mainstream and too weak in features for me.
So people, get the device YOU want. Don't be stupid fanboys believing your choice of smartphone will change anything. Elop has not set out to kill Nokia, he has set out to rescue an (almost) sunken ship. MS will not eat Nokia for lunch, but if they do, get over it, and do it fast. Stop being cry babies.
The only thing that matters is do Nokia make devices YOU want. If the answer is NO, then get something else and stop crying about it.
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2012-10-11
, 08:13
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Posts: 207 |
Thanked: 552 times |
Joined on Jul 2011
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#47
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Originally Posted by gerbick
No, they did not have a 'flat percentage of sales', they had 36% growth year on year, they had a respectable gross margin and their smart devices division was making healthy profits. Obsessing over market share when you have very healthy growth and a rapidly expanding market is vanity and vanity makes fools of us all.
Wait... wait. Isn't that just a way of saying that Nokia didn't sell enough? A flat percentage of sales in a growing market is basically the same as not meeting demand and thus, losing sales. And that's what happened.
iOS' market share is now declining against Android, I don't hear many people talking of how badly Apple are doing and how they need to abandon iOS and start again from scratch.
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2012-10-11
, 08:17
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Posts: 207 |
Thanked: 552 times |
Joined on Jul 2011
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#48
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Originally Posted by specc
web/mail and apps are not part of Symbian, Symbian is an OS. You wouldn't say Mercedes-Benz are no good because of the Blaupunkt stereo would you?
Symbian still is an "old school" smartphone OS. Powerful regarding HW, but weak in web/mail and apps.
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2012-10-11
, 08:31
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Posts: 207 |
Thanked: 552 times |
Joined on Jul 2011
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#49
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Originally Posted by specc
I assume you really mean the 5800 which had a 434MHz processor, 128 MB of RAM, resistive touch screen and no GPU.
Nokias answer was the 8500. This phone was rather successful. They also had the N97, which was a disaster of unprecedented magnitude. But the clunkiness of the 8500, sent many people away, and when Symbian^3 came, the clunkyness was still there.
I have used Android on a device with twice this spec and it was CHUFFING TORTURE.
The 5800 was great budget device of course, full of functionality, but stop pretending this was ever an iPhone competitor. Again it is a testament to Symbian you can get acceptable performance from such extraordinarily modest hardware.
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2012-10-11
, 08:37
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Posts: 207 |
Thanked: 552 times |
Joined on Jul 2011
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#50
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Originally Posted by NokiaFanatic
I agree, Symbian definitely did look a bit fusty. Of course once NOKIA had got QtQuick on there the UI would only have been limited by the designers imagination. Hey ho... what could have been.
When Ios and Android were released, they just looked so much more fresher than Symbian. What Nokia should have done was to ditch the Symbian name (and all its confusing variants). The next thing they should have done was completely reskin the OS. The default icons, fonts and menus looked terrible and dated, even if they were perfectly functional. Unfortunately, people were unable to look beyond this superficial detail, shame really
When Ios and Android were released, they just looked so much more fresher than Symbian. What Nokia should have done was to ditch the Symbian name (and all its confusing variants). The next thing they should have done was completely reskin the OS. The default icons, fonts and menus looked terrible and dated, even if they were perfectly functional. Unfortunately, people were unable to look beyond this superficial detail, shame really