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Navi is offline Navi
2008-03-11 , 02:57
Posts: 161 | Thanked: 75 times | Joined on Feb 2008
#31
Originally Posted by sherifnix View Post
Video is terrible above 400x240, audio is not gapless and sounds OK at best. There is no media management, the browser freaks out when there is mouse over code and you can't click/drag, the email doesn't work with gmail.
It's okay to go a bit higher 528x3xx or something. Having to transcode still sucks though. The default set of programs pretty much suck. Thankfully, it's an open platform and there are alternatives. mpd rules the gapless audio field and sound quality is good enough for those that aren't audiophiles. Browser doesn't freak out for me. Click/drag what? We have modest for email and that works great.

Originally Posted by sherifnix View Post
AACs and MP3's don't need conversion on touch, and 640x480 h.264 actually looks great (which the n800 can do none of)...
This implies that the NITs can't do so without conversion, which it can. It's not that it can't do it, as it is capable (just not

Originally Posted by sherifnix View Post
That said, IT SURE IS AN OPEN DEVICE! lol
I'm grateful it is. The ability to do what you want surpasses glitz and glam for me any day.
 
sherifnix is offline sherifnix
2008-03-11 , 03:06
Posts: 344 | Thanked: 26 times | Joined on Jan 2007
#32
Originally Posted by Navi View Post
It's okay to go a bit higher 528x3xx or something. Having to transcode still sucks though. The default set of programs pretty much suck. Thankfully, it's an open platform and there are alternatives. mpd rules the gapless audio field and sound quality is good enough for those that aren't audiophiles. Browser doesn't freak out for me. Click/drag what? We have modest for email and that works great.


This implies that the NITs can't do so without conversion, which it can. It's not that it can't do it, as it is capable (just not


I'm grateful it is. The ability to do what you want surpasses glitz and glam for me any day.
Its not just glitz and glam :/ I think I shall give up my quest to defend the Touch here. I like the Nokia's and I don't want to alienate myself too much, if I haven't already!

I appreciate the idea of the ITs, but I just get flustered when users here pan a very refined device, which in most respects has things that Nokia needs to learn from.
 
DJames1 is offline DJames1
2008-03-11 , 03:11
Posts: 215 | Thanked: 44 times | Joined on Dec 2007
#33
Ok, I'll take this one.

Originally Posted by sherifnix View Post
Video is terrible above 400x240
And the iPod would be better how?

audio is not gapless and sounds OK at best.
Gapless depends on the player software you use. And as for "OK at best", according to who? I have an iPod and an N800, as well as thousands of dollars of other fine audio equipment, and I detect no advantage between the iPod and the N800.

There is no media management
The media management works fine for me. Maybe you're a little too bought into the specific iPod interface?

the browser freaks out when there is mouse over code and you can't click/drag
Not that I've noticed.

the email doesn't work with gmail.
I use it with gmail. Works fine for me.

Rhapsody will only stream, not let you own.
As opposed to the iPod, where the subscription music services work so much better? Oh, wait... there aren't any.

And BTW, nothing stopping you from downloading tunes to your N800. I have thousands of them.

AACs and MP3's don't need conversion on touch
Nobody stores their music in the proprietary Apple AAC format except iTunes fanboys. I don't have a single AAC file on any of my systems or portable players. And MP3s don't need conversion on any player that I know of, including the N800.

and 640x480 h.264 actually looks great
Too iPod-specific, none of my other video players use h.264, so I don't store video in that format.

on its TV output which he conveniently forgets to put on the list.
I guess they forgot that feature on my iPod. But I don't really have much use for a limited composite video output on a portable device when I can so much more easily plug an SD card or USB memory stick into my video system directly.
Last edited by DJames1; 2008-03-11 at 03:15.
 
sherifnix is offline sherifnix
2008-03-11 , 03:43
Posts: 344 | Thanked: 26 times | Joined on Jan 2007
#34
Originally Posted by DJames1 View Post
Ok, I'll take this one.
Me too

And the iPod would be better how?
It doesn't tear or stutter. 1.5mpbs bitrate is fine on the iPod, 700 is about as high as you get on the N800.

640x352 h.264 video is very decent quality, barely less than DVD. This allows you to use one rip which functions on your Xbox 360, PS3, AppleTV, PSP or iPod/iPhone. You tell me, how is that better?

Gapless depends on the player software you use. And as for "OK at best", according to who? I have an iPod and an N800, as well as thousands of dollars of other fine audio equipment, and I detect no advantage between the iPod and the N800.
With some respectable headphones, just $99 sony studio monitors you can hear a reasonable difference. The gapless hasn't been possible so far on the N800, just another "potential" feature that everyone likes to say.

The media management works fine for me. Maybe you're a little too bought into the specific iPod interface?
Maybe I enjoy having my podcasts and music automatically synced, but thats just me.

Not that I've noticed.
This is another one that you'll eventually run into. I don't feel like thread searching, but with the introduction of MicroB and its better support of javascript, there is problem sites that look for mouse downs and what happens when you try to drag is that the javascript intercepts it and you can no longer drag scroll.

I use it with gmail. Works fine for me.
There is at least 2 or 3 threads mentioning the gmail IMAP incompatibility. It typically arises when there is more than 50 messages in the inbox (which isn't much).

As opposed to the iPod, where the subscription music services work so much better? Oh, wait... there aren't any.
True I could argue this, but I'd like a subscription service.

And BTW, nothing stopping you from downloading tunes to your N800. I have thousands of them.
I didn't say that

Nobody stores their music in the proprietary Apple AAC format except iTunes fanboys. I don't have a single AAC file on any of my systems or portable players. And MP3s don't need conversion on any player that I know of, including the N800.
How is AAC proprietary? Nokia, Nintendo, Sony, and Apple use AAC now. That said, I rip in MP3 just to be consistent.

Too iPod-specific, none of my other video players use h.264, so I don't store video in that format.
Xbox, PS3, PSP, Archos, Zune, AppleTV, Nokia Phones (N95, N81 etc...), YouTube...

I guess they forgot that feature on my iPod. But I don't really have much use for a limited composite video output on a portable device when I can so much more easily plug an SD card or USB memory stick into my video system directly.
You don't use it, others do. And its also component with 480p now.
 
CyberCat is offline CyberCat
2008-03-11 , 03:54
Posts: 213 | Thanked: 97 times | Joined on Jan 2008
#35
Originally Posted by sherifnix View Post
The gapless hasn't been possible so far on the N800, just another "potential" feature that everyone likes to say.
Can somebody explain to me why gapless playback is so über-essential? I remember when it was first introduced into iPods and it seemed like everybody was like "OMFWTFBBQ!!! APPLE IS TEH ROXR!". I personally find it rather annoying, I prefer my music to NOT play end to end non-stop. How come its such a huge deal?
 
sherifnix is offline sherifnix
2008-03-11 , 04:03
Posts: 344 | Thanked: 26 times | Joined on Jan 2007
#36
Originally Posted by CyberCat View Post
Can somebody explain to me why gapless playback is so über-essential? I remember when it was first introduced into iPods and it seemed like everybody was like "OMFWTFBBQ!!! APPLE IS TEH ROXR!". I personally find it rather annoying, I prefer my music to NOT play end to end non-stop. How come its such a huge deal?
A lot of albums are actually meant to be gapless, it only does this for those albums specifically. Live concerts, electronic music, jazz etc...
 
Navi is offline Navi
2008-03-11 , 04:16
Posts: 161 | Thanked: 75 times | Joined on Feb 2008
#37
Originally Posted by sherifnix View Post
It doesn't tear or stutter. 1.5mpbs bitrate is fine on the iPod, 700 is about as high as you get on the N800.
It's fine for me.

Originally Posted by sherifnix View Post
The gapless hasn't been possible so far on the N800, just another "potential" feature that everyone likes to say.
You ignored most of my other post; I already said gapless playback is possible.

Originally Posted by sherifnix View Post
This is another one that you'll eventually run into. I don't feel like thread searching, but with the introduction of MicroB and its better support of javascript, there is problem sites that look for mouse downs and what happens when you try to drag is that the javascript intercepts it and you can no longer drag scroll.
Yeah, that's pretty annoying. Thankfully, I scroll with the dpad. There aren't many of those sites, though. I hope it'll be fixed anyways.

Originally Posted by sherifnix View Post
How is AAC proprietary? Nokia, Nintendo, Sony, and Apple use AAC now. That said, I rip in MP3 just to be consistent.
Probably talking about DRM.
Last edited by Navi; 2008-03-11 at 04:22.
 
Benson's Avatar
Benson is offline Benson
2008-03-11 , 04:29
Posts: 4,930 | Thanked: 2,272 times | Joined on Oct 2007
#38
Originally Posted by CyberCat View Post
Um, what? It looks just fine to me, do you want it to be boxed like a spreadsheet or something? It says "stereo" because the N800 has two physical builtin speakers, and it says "no" because the iPod doesn't have any speakers built into it, this seems both correct and fair, I fail to see the problem here. Do you want it to say, "No, but the iPod might have speakers in the future!"? =/
Sorry on the stereo bit; I got confused regarding which rows were supposed to line up.

I'm not saying it should have borders; I'm talking about the html structure. When you want a table, the thing to do is:
HTML Code:
<table>
  <tr>
    <td><b>Item</b></td>
    <td>Value A</td>
    <td>Value B</td>
  </tr>
  <tr>
    <td><b>Long item</b></td>
    <td>Value A</td>
    <td>Value B</td>
  </tr>
  <tr>
    <td><b>Item</b></td>
    <td>Value A</td>
    <td>Value B is really long, too</td>
  </tr>
</table>
What this page has is
HTML Code:
<table>
  <tr>
    <td>
      <b>Item<br>
      Long item<br>
      Item</b>
    </td>
    <td>
      Value A<br>
      Value A<br>
      Value A
    </td>
    <td>
      Value B<br>
      Value B<br>
      Value B is really long, too
    </td>
  </tr>
</table>
If you have the same fonts available, the same DPI, and the same default CSS as the author, the latter will come out looking OK, because none of the lines wrap; presentation details will create the illusion of proper structure.

But this approach is wrong for several reasons. Non-typical useragents (such as readers for the blind) don't understand the structure, and will read all the items, then all the N800 values, then all the iPod values. Presentation details cannot readily be controlled with stylesheets. And, perhaps most persuasively, with an ordinary useragent, such as Opera on my desktop, or Microb on my N800, the page is quite likely to display brokenly. An example is shown in the attached screenshot: Microb, 100% zoom, no width-fitting or anything.
Attached Images
 
 
Benson's Avatar
Benson is offline Benson
2008-03-11 , 04:47
Posts: 4,930 | Thanked: 2,272 times | Joined on Oct 2007
#39
Originally Posted by sherifnix View Post
There is at least 2 or 3 threads mentioning the gmail IMAP incompatibility. It typically arises when there is more than 50 messages in the inbox (which isn't much).
I think you're confusing two issues; there have been incompatibilities with GMail IMAP and the built-in client (still present, AFAIK) and Claws (fixed, I've heard). I've heard of no incompatibilities with Modest, but it does have an issue, which is not specific to GMail; you can set it to retrieve headers of the last 50 messages, but you can't set it to discard older headers, so they accumulate.

I'm using Modest with GMail, and 3741 messages in my inbox.
 
CyberCat is offline CyberCat
2008-03-11 , 04:56
Posts: 213 | Thanked: 97 times | Joined on Jan 2008
#40
Originally Posted by Benson View Post
Sorry on the stereo bit; I got confused regarding which rows were supposed to line up.
Oh yeah, I see. No problem.

I hadn't realized you were looking at it with MicroB, I'm using Firefox here and it looks fine. I had also looked at the source (before you mentioned it) and it is odd that the designer put ever thing in two <tr>s. I guess either he was lazy or was going for a particular 'look', there's no excuse for sloppy coding though.
 
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