Originally Posted by redi

Had I done little research before ordering and buying, I would have not done it. I expect a device of this price to have support (more than namely support) for longer than a ~year. If updating N900 to Maemo 6 isn't possible, I'm pretty surely boycotting Nokia in the future. Just look how Apple does it's OS updates? Wouldn't hurt Nokia.

Originally Posted by Texrat

I know I said a lot (too much) on this topic already, but it hits areas that I'm passionate about.

I do understand the newcomer frustrations because I have them elsewhere. Like a certain musician's community I joined last year. I was met with a mix of welcome and hostility by different members and it wasn't altogether fun.

But I'm having trouble with the "we don't know where to go or what to say" complaint.

THIS subforum, Community, is the place to bring your policy and process issues. Maybe the section byline can make that clearer-- suggestions welcome.

And the last part of the above gets to the heart of MY issue. Some of us are voluntarily working hard and could really use some community guidance to speed things up and make for better solutions. But there are far too many who want to pop in, drop a few incendiary grenades, and drop out.

If you have a complaint, odds are you've seen something done better elsewhere... so suggest something!

I don't mind complaints per se. But I do mind purposeless rants (I don't see occasional venting as purposeless unless it goes on too long).

So I'm having a tough time swallowing the "I feel awkward speaking up" claim when it's made in the body of a long-held complaint. Help us help you. Speak up-- in useful places and contexts. But have a look around first. Get your bearings. Get to know us. Then jump in!

Thanks.

If people help you, then it's good manners, to be as helpful back. I ain't a developer or a coder (poor vbscript isn't much use around here), but I try to contribute where it is positive, even if it is just saying thanks..

Originally Posted by Texrat

Sorry, I was still unclear.... and still am. I'm honestly wanting suggestions on what to put in place, not simply what's flawed. We old-timers have a lot of ideas, and keep kicking them around, but good, solid suggestions from newcomers can't be beat.

What has worked for you elsewhere? What specific solutions do you have?

EDIT: I want to apologize to you specifically if we have fallen in our responsibility to reach out. I will personally work on improving that. And I apologize to everyone in this thread for talking so much and so intensely. Got a little carried away.

Originally Posted by RevdKathy

I'm going to jump in and thank Emma for some excellent suggestions. And probably alarm the long-time users by admitting that I feel less welcome here now than when I first arrived. I feel - and I accept that it's a feeling and it would take a lot of effort to pin-point why - that some of the long-time regulars have hardened in their attitude to newcomers. Given the sheer size of the influx that would be understandable: when I arrived we were few enough to be a novelty. So I'd echo some of what Emma says about tone.

You want practical suggestions for making the place more welcoming? The trouble is they're all still in planning and development and I know the answer will be "we're working on that". But meanwhile, newcomers still arrive.

Anyway to list the suggestions:

* Single site log-in
* Tame Bugzilla or get him a little less-fierce brother
* Work out how you want brainstorm to function - and till then don't tell people off for doing it wrong: we don't know what right is.
* Make good feedback from testing easy to provide - make the 'where' of feedback easy to find.
* Make the wiki much more visible from the talk page
* Make Power search the default option
* Improve the search in wiki

And one extra: make a general n900 forum that's not about hardware or fremantle and let the people who want to rant do it there.

I have loved being here. I was made incredibly welcome when I arrived. I have received endless help, advice, patience as well as warmth and friendship. So why do I feel so awkward here now?

Originally Posted by EmmaGx

complaining about "a huge influx of new members with no obvious bent toward community or contribution" (yes, that was you!) don't help make newcomers feel welcome

Originally Posted by EmmaGx

I know that in the same post I quoted you also praised RevdKathy for the contribution that she has made and said you'd welcome more users like her - but the tone made it sound like you're judging us all waiting to see which category we fall into instead of encouraging people into the more helpful category.

Originally Posted by Texrat

I'll ask only one thing of you (or any other stranger): benefit of the doubt. I'll gladly offer it in kind. That said, I realize my taking your words personally violated that so mea culpa.