Originally Posted by Texrat

Um... that was meant for very specific people. If the description doesn't fit, you weren't so labeled. Do you really weant to defend anyone fitting that description?

But FYI: go see whose user name is at the bottom of almost every newcomer post in the "welcome" thread, Thanking them.



Not trying to dismiss your interpretation, but that tone wasn't there. Not intentionally or unintentionally.

This may come across as offensive and I'll pre-emptively apologize if so, but I note an automatic defensivess in your own "tone". You appear to be looking for slams, slights, etc that aren't there... and put a great deal of effort (verbiage) into building a straw-man case for it.

I'll ask only one thing of you (or any other stranger): benefit of the doubt. I'll gladly offer it in kind. That said, I realize my taking your words personally violated that so mea culpa.

Just as "old timers" can err too far toward elitism with regards to turf, newcomers can err too far toward sensitivity. I think it behooves us all to move toward middle ground.

Originally Posted by EmmaGx

... you asked me to offer specific suggestions of how to make newcomers feel more welcome ... I'm not looking for "slams or slights" except to offer you constructive suggestions of how the forum could be more welcoming. If you didn't want to hear anything more from me on the matter, then you really shouldn't have asked.

My suggestion was (as I don't think it was clear in the earlier post!) that if as a community you want more constructive members of the forum maybe it would be better to gently push people in that direction, and assume that everyone is capable of changing, rather than writing off a whole section of newbies who don't meet the old guard's standards for inclusion into the community.

... now, while it's very nice of you to go and personally click the Thanks! button under every single newbie post in the newbie thread, I'm not convinced that most of the newbies who post in that thread realise you have thanked them ... it's not the most effective way of making newcomers feel welcome ... hopefully any of them posting questions in the outside world recieved polite and helpful responses, as that's more likely what they were looking for.

I'm sorry, you seem to be taking all of my criticisms and suggestions personally ... honestly, I am not trying to pick at you, I am just trying to offer you constructive suggestions for making newcomers feel more welcome, as you asked. However your responses to my suggestions give me the impression you already feel that you do enough, and aren't willing to accept that I don't feel as comfortable here as you would like. I also feel like I'm being blamed for feeling the way that I feel, despite other people indicating in this thread that they've had similar feelings. As such I don't feel comfortable offering any future suggestions about making the forum a more welcoming place, so please don't ask or expect for me to continue contributing ideas to this topic.

Originally Posted by Texrat

Yeah. I'm frustrated at seeing my words maliciously twisted into ugly shapes. : /

Originally Posted by fatalsaint

Well.. with all due absolute respect Tex... I don't think she's the only one in this case....

I think in this one instance you got a little too involved buddy.

Originally Posted by Texrat

But-- it's unfair to wantonly attack hardworking, longstanding members of this community-- especially over misconceptions that are (and have been) easily clarified.

My suggestion was (as I don't think it was clear in the earlier post!) that if as a community you want more constructive members of the forum maybe it would be better to gently push people in that direction, and assume that everyone is capable of changing, rather than writing off a whole section of newbies who don't meet the old guard's standards for inclusion into the community.

Originally Posted by CrashandDie

...getting repeated all over the forum and that as a whole kingdom of information, information itself has to be very very easy to find. Unless people get quick replies that actually answer the question, people won't feel welcome.

If a forum is a helpful information fest, then people, no matter whether they're newcomers or old-timers will be chipping in and offering information and advice, even if that means they have to dig for that information themselves in the first place. The opposite is equally true, if there are 10 threads that complain about feature x, or problem y, then nearly everyone will be chipping in. It's the black sheep thingy: only the most dedicated and committed individuals will have the strength to at least try and set back some untruths spoken out of rage or despair.

Hope this helps,